How's the weather?

[Marti Talbott]

We had a hellacious summer. Normally our hot months are July through mid-September, but this year we hit 106 in June and it stayed in the 100 degree range until just last week. Of course, our air-conditioner/heater went out and because of shortages and long delivery times, we'll be lucky to see a replacement by Christmas. They said two weeks a month ago.

Meanwhile, we had thunder storms, cloud bursts, and floods that were so severe they wiped out the interstate between us and Denver. My brother grows peaches, etc., and hauls them to Denver, so he was forced to take other, less dependable highways in a semi-truck across the Rocky Mountains for several weeks. It was scary for us because he's an old man, older than me, even. Thankfully, harvest is over and it's now vacation time.

The bears came down out of the mountains looking for water. We didn't get much snow last year, so they didn't have much choice. Still, one tried to get in my sister-in-law's house and really terrified her. She was inside, and the bear moved from window to window as she ran through the house trying to find a place to hide. Thankfully, it didn't break any windows and finally went away.

You can see images of the I-70 damage here:

https://www.google.com/search?q=damage+to+interstate+70&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS697US697&sxsrf=AOaemvKT4xWnLAJaiSZdLlsPzgNLxcUmIw:1632868128667&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi4spjm26LzAhUSvJ4KHa2PC8UQ_AUoA3oECAEQBQ&biw=1010&bih=490&dpr=1.65

So how's the weather where you are?

[Eric Thomson]

It's been pretty normal in Eastern Ontario. No extremes and a little cooler than previous summers. All in all, I give it 9/10, mainly because I prefer warmer weather and haven't been able to visit the Caribbean in over a year and a half.

[Maggie Ann]

It's been pretty normal in Eastern Ontario. No extremes and a little cooler than previous summers. All in all, I give it 9/10, mainly because I prefer warmer weather and haven't been able to visit the Caribbean in over a year and a half.

That's about how our weather was here in FL. Rains were delayed but we've had some tropical downpours and September had been more humid than usual, although temps are cooler.

[Jeff Tanyard]

Lots of rain from mid-June through August, so I didn't get outside much during that time.  Even when it wasn't raining, the ground was waterlogged and the air was like a steam room.  I've been indoors most of the summer.   

The past few days have been quite nice, though.  Eighties and low humidity.  I was sitting outside this afternoon--I'm trying to enjoy these rare pleasant days while I can--when I was startled by some loud flapping.  Two birds flew into the holly tree and disappeared among the thick leaves.  I didn't get a good look at them going in.  A moment later, though, a hawk flew out.  It was empty-taloned, so whatever it was chasing--probably a pigeon--presumably remained safe in the tree. 

Anyway, that was something I don't see every day.  Pretty neat.

[PJ Post]

Climate change much?

[Marti Talbott]

I'm not buying into the climate change theory. It seems to me preposterous that we think we can somehow change the weather. After all, it wasn't long ago they said we were entering another ice age. It didn't happen  Just my opinion.

[cecilia_writer]

We had some torrential rain and localised flooding here in Edinburgh in August - it traditionally rains during the Edinburgh Festival so that is nothing new. We've had a reasonable summer apart from that but it has got quite cold in the last week or two, which is also not that unusual.

[Maggie Ann]

I'm not buying into the climate change theory. It seems to me preposterous that we think we can somehow change the weather. After all, it wasn't long ago they said we were entering another ice age. It didn't happen  Just my opinion.

I remember the ice age prediction and I agree with your opinion. Climate change has been going on for many millennia and will go on for many millennia or as long as the earth lasts.

We all know, or at least those of us in the US know, about Valley Forge and the brutal winter our revolutionary soldiers went through. That was at the end of a mini ice age that had lasted for about the previous 500 years. Those who adapted to the colder growing conditions survived, and those who didn't, did not survive. The only intelligent thing I have heard coming out of these global conferences is how to adapt to the hotter growing conditions.

[PJ Post]

I'm not buying into the climate change theory. It seems to me preposterous that we think we can somehow change the weather. After all, it wasn't long ago they said we were entering another ice age. It didn't happen  Just my opinion.

Well, the good news is that there's nothing we can do to stop it now, so the debate is going to resolve itself in relative short order. The other good news is that, if it is real, most of us will be dead before the worst of it hits.

 


...well, apart from the fresh water shortage.



And this is how we know that's real...

https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/07/investing/water-futures-trading/index.html
https://money.usnews.com/investing/stock-market-news/slideshows/ways-to-invest-in-water

[Marti Talbott]

I'm not buying into the climate change theory. It seems to me preposterous that we think we can somehow change the weather. After all, it wasn't long ago they said we were entering another ice age. It didn't happen  Just my opinion.

I remember the ice age prediction and I agree with your opinion. Climate change has been going on for many millennia and will go on for many millennia or as long as the earth lasts.

We all know, or at least those of us in the US know, about Valley Forge and the brutal winter our revolutionary soldiers went through. That was at the end of a mini ice age that had lasted for about the previous 500 years. Those who adapted to the colder growing conditions survived, and those who didn't, did not survive. The only intelligent thing I have heard coming out of these global conferences is how to adapt to the hotter growing conditions.

My grandfather was born in the middle of the unexpected 1888 blizzard that killed thousands from the Midwest to the east coast. At least we've gotten better at forecasting the weather. Changing it is another matter. If it were possible, we would figure out how to prevent hurricane damage when they first form off the coast of Africa. But then, dare we prevent weather? Is it possible to interrupt it to the point of actually doing harm?

[Marti Talbott]

I'm not buying into the climate change theory. It seems to me preposterous that we think we can somehow change the weather. After all, it wasn't long ago they said we were entering another ice age. It didn't happen  Just my opinion.

Well, the good news is that there's nothing we can do to stop it now, so the debate is going to resolve itself in relative short order. The other good news is that, if it is real, most of us will be dead before the worst of it hits.

 


...well, apart from the fresh water shortage.



And this is how we know that's real...

https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/07/investing/water-futures-trading/index.html
https://money.usnews.com/investing/stock-market-news/slideshows/ways-to-invest-in-water

I can't tell if that's the Colorado River. If it is, the good news from the Farmer's almanac is that we should have lots of snow in the mountains this winter. Hopefully, that will replace what we lost  last year. I didn't know people were buying water futures. Interesting.

[notthatamanda]

Our New England Summer was very, very, very rainy. I'm not saying anything about the weather right now cause I don't want to jinx it.

[Lynn]

This idea that the Earth is unchangeable and unchanging is funny. Humans are definitely leaving their mark. The only question I have about it is whether it's wrong of us to do it. I kind of feel like there's no point to life other than to live, so if we mess up Earth in our efforts to live in relative comfort and harmony as a species, it doesn't really matter in the end. What's it hurt if Earth dies in 10,000 years instead of 1,000,000,000,000? What's the point of making sure the species survives? Generations, sure, but indefinitely? Who out there is really going to care if humans are around in another hundred thousand years? The Earth isn't a sentient being. It's a very pretty rock in space that might be less pretty when we're done with it, but does it really matter in the end?

[Post-Crisis D]

When Martian polar ice caps melt, that's because of the sun.

When Earth's polar ice caps melt, that's because of people.

[PJ Post]

I can't tell if that's the Colorado River. If it is, the good news from the Farmer's almanac is that we should have lots of snow in the mountains this winter. Hopefully, that will replace what we lost  last year. I didn't know people were buying water futures. Interesting.

Yep, it's Lake Mead. And it's been going on for years, so no single winter is likely to replenish it. The last generation of wars were over oil, the next wave will be over water. Climate refugees are already a thing.

And I know climate change is happening because I'm old enough to see it first hand. I used to be on the fence about the cause, but now it's pretty clear that it's us humans. Again, there's nothing we can do so there's no reason to panic or argue about it.

This idea that the Earth is unchangeable and unchanging is funny. Humans are definitely leaving their mark. The only question I have about it is whether it's wrong of us to do it. I kind of feel like there's no point to life other than to live, so if we mess up Earth in our efforts to live in relative comfort and harmony as a species, it doesn't really matter in the end. What's it hurt if Earth dies in 10,000 years instead of 1,000,000,000,000? What's the point of making sure the species survives? Generations, sure, but indefinitely? Who out there is really going to care if humans are around in another hundred thousand years? The Earth isn't a sentient being. It's a very pretty rock in space that might be less pretty when we're done with it, but does it really matter in the end?

I've always looked at the Earth as a wonderful garden, one that we were lucky enough to rent. One might think we should keep it nice, just in case we wanted to have friends over. Our lease even has some vague language about being broom clean when we leave, but I think it's safe to say we're not getting our deposit back.

Morally, I think it sucks that humans are in the middle of causing the latest mass extinction (Anthropocene). But I'm not sure that the universe cares one way or the other. I mean, humans didn't exist for 13.6 billion years or so, our lives are over in the proverbial blink of an eye and then we cease to exist for...trillions of years? Let's just call it forever. So, given this ultra-brief moment of existence, it's easy to see how folks would want to find happiness however they can.

And the earth will officially die in about 4 billion years when the sun turns into a red giant. Well, it will probably be pretty low-rent way before then, but that's the longest it's got.

When Martian polar ice caps melt, that's because of the sun.

When Earth's polar ice caps melt, that's because of people.

Nah, ice melts due to heat. And heat has a lot of causes, not the least of which is <insert hot celebrity joke here>.

eta:   

[Matthew]

Global warming is happening, that should not be considered under dispute: https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

What we might seek to prove are whether this warming is part of the normal cycle of the Earth (such as magnetic poles flipping) or whether the temperature increase is due to human activity.

Naturally, we have also proven carbon dioxide acts as a sort of insulator which can cause a greenhouse effect: https://scied.ucar.edu/learning-zone/how-climate-works/greenhouse-effect

We have, in a hundred years, put about 33% more carbon dioxide into the atmosphere.

So we have the theory that the increase in such gas (measured) that has an insulating property (measured) has caused the increase in temperature (measured). It doesn't technically prove global warming is caused by humans emitting more greenhouse gases, but it is a strong correlation. (And one thing to keep in mind on this note: this is mainly caused by industry, not by individuals)

The good news, is we are unlikely to cause a "runaway" reaction of heating the Earth beyond its ability to self-regulate, but it could get very uncomfortable for humans with more heat waves and harsher summers. Likewise, sure it can result in further melting of ice which will cause oceans to rise and even has the potential to alter ocean currents. Severe storms will become more common with an increase in temperature.

But what is the harm in trusting scientists? They have given us vaccines, they have given us technology. When they discover they are wrong, they correct their mistakes in the literature and use the new understanding to further push civilization forward.

Anyway, the weather here in GA, US hasn't been too bad. We really didn't get a lot of rain until we got some of it from those recent hurricanes / tropical storms.

[Post-Crisis D]

But what is the harm in trusting scientists?

For starters . . .

Thalidomide
Killer Bees
Overuse of Antibiotics
Fen-phen
Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether
Vioxx
Frontal Lobotomies
Meridia
Microsoft Vista
Chantix

[PJ Post]

But what is the harm in trusting scientists?

For starters . . .

Thalidomide
Killer Bees
Overuse of Antibiotics
Fen-phen
Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether
Vioxx
Frontal Lobotomies
Meridia
Microsoft Vista
Chantix

Are these examples of bad science or unrepentant capitalism?

[LilyBLily]

We usually have drought conditions as early as April and for sure by August. This year, there was torrential rain often enough that there's no drought.

Having been to Antarctica and seen the melting Larsen ice shelf, I am a believer that climate change is occurring. I don't bother to be political about it. I remember how bad smog was in 1970 in Washington, DC, and how much better the air is now. We can improve things, but every time I see a truck deliberately or carelessly polluting, I'm reminded that there are too many people who want to be part of the problem.

The idea that none of it matters in the long run because eventually everything spirals into the dying sun is a fine one, but it's also a doorway to selfishness right now that impacts the quality of my life and of the other people living on this planet right now and for ages to come.

We are transients, but that's no excuse for trashing the planet.

[Post-Crisis D]

But what is the harm in trusting scientists?

For starters . . .

Thalidomide
Killer Bees
Overuse of Antibiotics
Fen-phen
Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether
Vioxx
Frontal Lobotomies
Meridia
Microsoft Vista
Chantix

Are these examples of bad science or unrepentant capitalism?

Nine are examples of bad science.  The other is an example that Microsoft sucks.

[Matthew]

For starters . . .

I think it's rather boring to argue too hard on the subject. The short version is, we have used crop breeding and GMOs for millennia resulting in crops with better yields and resistance to disease. On the whole, a net positive compared to some bad results. Medicines are difficult to develop. We have had mishaps along the way. We have more stringent drug testing requirements than ever, and if we discover drugs are dangerous, they're removed from the market. The fact that we can even study the effects of drugs long term is amazing. We have the technology to look at the individual parts of the hearts (in the case of one your listed drugs, heart valves) and know how it is performing. Historically, it's been, "idk, here's some cocaine." Or bloodletting, etc. In the meantime, basically every drug has some side effects, the question is whether the side effects are worse than the cure they provide. In a similar vein, vaccines and antibiotics have saved countless lives. Hospitals and doctors have more restrictions on antibiotics now. Frontal lobotomies are tragic, to be sure -- but it was interesting in that they proved certain parts of the brain were directly linked to certain mental illnesses. As it turned out, the side effects from lobotomies were worse than the mental illnesses, so the procedures were stopped.

Our medicine gets much better over time. I think it's foolish to argue on that point. Life span has basically doubled in 300 years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy if you want to go back in time and forego all medicine and medical technology, feel free. Now rather than dying of "old age" we have descriptors like "cardiovascular disease" and "cancer". When we look at the biggest threats to our life expectancy, we seek to mitigate them. Even seemingly simple items like mineral deficiencies have been regulated into our diet, such as iodine in salt and niacin in bread. We are much healthier for it.

And to be sure, science is obviously not perfect. We've had other things discovered to be dangerous, like CFCs. As a whole, we are also willing to accept some negatives for a generally improved quality of life (such as gasoline powered vehicles). One of the biggest innovations - plastics - have proven to be one of the biggest polluters. It's a balancing act, and we are always researching new materials.

Science is about experimenting and iterative improvement.

[LilyBLily]

They used mercury to "cure" syphilis back in the day because they didn't have anything else. It was horribly painful and it didn't work, either. A hundred years from now, our medicine and our science will be looked on as primitive--I hope! We're incredibly lucky today, regardless, compared to the past.

[elleoco]

Here in Colorado it's been a good summer by my lights. I hate heat, so the summers when we have a lot of days in the high 90s and even a few that tip over 100 are the worst for me. This year we did have a lot of rain early on after a drought-like winter. I had weeds in my yard chest high, and can't say I like that. The summer itself, though, was good with only a few days in the high 90s and in this area none over 97 much less reaching 100.

As to science, the problem is as it always is with the human factor. Scientists misinterpret their own results, rig things to come out the way they want, refuse to admit the truth of things that go against their own biases, etc. Just look back to what happened after men like Lister proved germ theory. Many, many doctors refused to accept it for years, continuing to treat wounds and operate in filthy conditions without even washing their hands.

Today people are bending and plain lying about science for political reasons - telling "noble lies" to us ignorant peons.

[R. C.]

Here in Colorado it's been a good summer by my lights. I hate heat, so the summers when we have a lot of days in the high 90s and even a few that tip over 100 are the worst for me. This year we did have a lot of rain early on after a drought-like winter. I had weeds in my yard chest high, and can't say I like that. The summer itself, though, was good with only a few days in the high 90s and in this area none over 97 much less reaching 100.

As to science, the problem is as it always is with the human factor. Scientists misinterpret their own results, rig things to come out the way they want, refuse to admit the truth of things that go against their own biases, etc. Just look back to what happened after men like Lister proved germ theory. Many, many doctors refused to accept it for years, continuing to treat wounds and operate in filthy conditions without even washing their hands.

Today people are bending and plain lying about science for political reasons - telling "noble lies" to us ignorant peons.

I enjoy the heat. I second the Colorado weather has been spectacular!

As to science... Yeah, maybe not. I have too few friends now.   

R.C.

[Matthew]

Ugh I love the heat. I was born in FL and visited recently and I miss the weather greatly. I weigh 135 lbs on a good day at 6' -- every time I go to the doctor he reminds me I'm underweight and wants to determine if I have some eating disorder. Florida summers can get rough though simply due to the humidity. You have to be careful about working outside in the hot weather too long.

I tend to keep my house at 78-80 F in the summer, and 74-76 F in the winter. I pretty much never leave the house without a jacket. People just don't understand that when I'm so skinny I have no way to keep myself warm. I will say though it is on the other hand nice to experience all four seasons. We even sometimes get snow. Amazing how much of a difference 300 miles makes. I really don't miss the hurricanes though. Deciding on weathering it out or evacuating, boarding up the house etc. I don't know how the retirees down there do it.

[Maggie Ann]

Ugh I love the heat. I was born in FL and visited recently and I miss the weather greatly. I weigh 135 lbs on a good day at 6' -- every time I go to the doctor he reminds me I'm underweight and wants to determine if I have some eating disorder. Florida summers can get rough though simply due to the humidity. You have to be careful about working outside in the hot weather too long.

I tend to keep my house at 78-80 F in the summer, and 74-76 F in the winter. I pretty much never leave the house without a jacket. People just don't understand that when I'm so skinny I have no way to keep myself warm. I will say though it is on the other hand nice to experience all four seasons. We even sometimes get snow. Amazing how much of a difference 300 miles makes. I really don't miss the hurricanes though. Deciding on weathering it out or evacuating, boarding up the house etc. I don't know how the retirees down there do it.

I've lived in FL since 1958 and I still miss the four seasons. But, FL certainly has it's compensations. As for being a retiree in FL, I stock up ahead of the season, close up my accordion shutters (wonderful invention) and hunker down.

[PJ Post]

Nine are examples of bad science.  The other is an example that Microsoft sucks.

Sorry, but - in my opinion - you're wrong. All of these "scientists" work for large corporations with marketing departments and, more importantly, shareholders. Like Mathew said, the science end of it is ever-evolving and self-correcting. But, like elleco also said, sometimes these corrections are influenced by politics - and other big-money interests. So, I don't think it is fair to lay the bad here solely at the feet of science.

And Microsoft is a nuanced thing: sometimes they're the best ever, and other times...

The idea that none of it matters in the long run because eventually everything spirals into the dying sun is a fine one, but it's also a doorway to selfishness right now that impacts the quality of my life and of the other people living on this planet right now and for ages to come.

We are transients, but that's no excuse for trashing the planet.

I agree, but...I think it's also fair to say that understanding the allure of nihilism does not necessitate that we embrace it, at least not as individuals. It's like saying that a moral life is only possible through the embrace of religion.