Author Topic: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...  (Read 2407 times)

JRTomlin

Could someone breaking into a house crawl around on a thatch roof? And not put a foot or something through the thatch? Not worried about damaging the thatch obviously? And would they make like 'thumping' sounds? Crackling sounds? Any help?

 

Post-Crisis D

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2021, 04:57:07 AM »
Thatch roofs have support beneath them.  Here is a photo of the inside of a building with a thatched roof:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thatching#/media/File:Thatched_Roof_Inside_View.jpg

Other images show that the spacing between supports varies.  In the above example, I would think one could easily crawl on top, depending upon pitch, without accidentally pushing a foot through.  One familiar with local structures and how they are built would likely have a good idea of where to crawl.

I don't think they would be like movies where people fall through thatched roofs rather easily.  If a person could fall through easily, or even their foot, imagine how poorly the roof would stand up to a heavy rainstorm or large snowfall.

Also, too, people would have to be able to move around on the roof to repair, replace or recover a thatched roof.

As for sounds, I would guess that may depend upon the amount of insulation used inside the house?
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 
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JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2021, 05:54:03 AM »
Googling, I did see warnings to be careful in repairing them not to damage them, but I think you must be right that it couldn't be that easy to put a foot through.

I don't think medieval houses had insulation though. 😜
 

Post-Crisis D

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2021, 06:01:33 AM »
I don't think medieval houses had insulation though. 😜

Maybe not.  I guess the thing is do you want the thief to be heard or not?  Because I read that some roofs could get to be 7' thick on some buildings as they recovered and recovered them.  So, I guess you make the roof as new and thin-ish or as old and thick-ish as needed depending on how muffled you want the crawling to be.
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 

JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2021, 06:09:20 AM »
I have them crawling on the roof and making thumps. I just don't want some expert on thatch roofs (you may be SURE there are some out there) posting a one-star review and cursing at me for daring to say something impossible about them.

Many readers of HF are unbelievably picky about that sort of thing. I once threw a book across the room because the author put a spinning wheel in the wrong century. It would have been a spindle as any idiot should have known, I shouted irately.  🤷‍♀️🤣
 

Post-Crisis D

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2021, 06:24:19 AM »
I have them crawling on the roof and making thumps. I just don't want some expert on thatch roofs (you may be SURE there are some out there) posting a one-star review and cursing at me for daring to say something impossible about them.

I don't know if they would thump.  It wouldn't be like thumping on a shingled roof because those usually have the plywood boards underneath them, so there's something solid.  Whereas the thatch roofing material is more akin to fiber bundles which I would think would absorb sounds better.


Many readers of HF are unbelievably picky about that sort of thing. I once threw a book across the room because the author put a spinning wheel in the wrong century. It would have been a spindle as any idiot should have known, I shouted irately.  🤷‍♀️🤣

My "historical fiction" takes place in the future, long after the zombie apocalypse destroyed civilization and they rebuild.  So it's perfectly fine to be living in a thatched-roof house working on the computer by candlelight.  Also angry squirrels.
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 
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JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2021, 07:27:07 AM »
Especially angry squirrels. 😜

Maybe a muffled thud?
 

Post-Crisis D

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2021, 07:38:26 AM »
Maybe a muffled thud?

Sounds reasonable to me.

Question is would anyone inside think it's a person on the roof or possibly an animal?  Birds are known to remove material from thatched roofs for nests and it's probably a safe guess other animals would get up there too.

Especially angry squirrels.  grint

Probably raccoons too.  Depends on geographical location as well.
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 
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JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2021, 07:47:01 AM »
My MC is pretty used to people trying to kill him so that it is an assassin is no great shock. 😜
 

Mike_Bravo

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2021, 03:20:38 AM »
Could someone breaking into a house crawl around on a thatch roof? And not put a foot or something through the thatch? Not worried about damaging the thatch obviously? And would they make like 'thumping' sounds? Crackling sounds? Any help?

There's not enough info here to answer --- thatched roofing can be a variety of materials in a variety of climates and time periods and regions. I can also be a relatively new roof or one that's decades old and very thick.

What is the current climate?  If it's super dry, you could have cracking of material, but if it's moss after a rain, it's not likely to make such a noise.

In any case, for sure someone could climb around on it unless it's been weather damaged or super old and decaying because to build it and maintain the thing it has to be able to take the weight of someone working on it. If it's in a climate that gets snow, it's going to able to take a lot of weight, if it's in the South Pacific, not necessarily so much.

Likely you could set up the situation to be whatever you needed for the story to work.

 

JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2021, 03:30:12 AM »
I tend to assume that everyone knows that I write about medieval Scotland, but no doubt I should have mentioned it. So the climate is wet and the period is medieval. It is not a new roof but is in good condition. 😜
 

Mike_Bravo

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2021, 05:34:59 AM »
Thick and wet means there's not much chance of random cracking noises, imho --- however, a quick Google image search seems to show super steep pitches so a wet steep roof would easily lead to a slip and trying to not fall to the ground would certainly lead to some potential noises.
I'd find that believable, in any case.
 
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JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2021, 05:41:46 AM »
Thanks.  :cheers
 

spin52

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2021, 09:18:27 PM »
Mike makes a good point about the pitch of the roof. Your assassin might move along the ridge, but unless it's the sort with windows set into the roof -- which would be unlikely in medieval times, I would think -- they're going to have a devil of a time keeping from sliding down the sides. Especially in a wet climate. I don't know about medieval Scotland, but roofs in our area are thatched with reeds which shoot the rain off and it would be hard to get much traction.
So to answer your original question -- yes, I think your character might hear someone moving along the roof ridge.
I just asked my local expert, who added that A) It would depend on their footwear and B) even if their footsteps couldn't be heard, they might well loosen bits of thatch as they moved, which could be heard falling.
     


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JRTomlin

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2021, 03:43:39 AM »
Thanks for all the help!
 

LeonardDHilleyII

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2022, 11:50:49 PM »
I have them crawling on the roof and making thumps. I just don't want some expert on thatch roofs (you may be SURE there are some out there) posting a one-star review and cursing at me for daring to say something impossible about them.

Many readers of HF are unbelievably picky about that sort of thing. I once threw a book across the room because the author put a spinning wheel in the wrong century. It would have been a spindle as any idiot should have known, I shouted irately.  🤷‍♀️🤣
  :hehe

A person's weight and the age of the boards under the thatch could also be factors in any sounds made. An older roof with bad supports should creak with someone walking across. My guess is that the thatch would muffle the footsteps, but if the boards beneath might make noise.

Have you seen this site? https://dustinjohnsonexteriors.com/how-often-does-a-thatched-roof-need-to-be-replaced/
 

R. C.

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2022, 01:27:58 AM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.

« Last Edit: January 23, 2022, 01:37:20 AM by R. C. »
 

LeonardDHilleyII

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2022, 02:00:39 AM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.

Thanks! I'm in process of doing that, too.
 

Eric Thomson

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2022, 02:41:20 AM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.
A few things.
1) a .ru email addy is in Russia. They don't give a flying f*ck about DMCA over there, so nothing will happen.
2) I checked the site (cautiously, it goes without saying) and my anti-virus went apesh*t. If you've actually opened a book webpage there, you should run a virus scan on your PC. Better yet, run a full Spybot scan.

That leads me to believe the site, while it may have our books, is scammy as hell. Folks who read our books there deserve whatever malware they get. I won't waste time or energy sending takedowns. They'd be futile.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2022, 02:43:44 AM by Eric Thomson »
 

LeonardDHilleyII

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2022, 03:51:51 AM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.
A few things.
1) a .ru email addy is in Russia. They don't give a flying f*ck about DMCA over there, so nothing will happen.
2) I checked the site (cautiously, it goes without saying) and my anti-virus went apesh*t. If you've actually opened a book webpage there, you should run a virus scan on your PC. Better yet, run a full Spybot scan.

That leads me to believe the site, while it may have our books, is scammy as hell. Folks who read our books there deserve whatever malware they get. I won't waste time or energy sending takedowns. They'd be futile.

Thanks!
 

R. C.

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2022, 05:40:53 AM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.

UPDATE: Of course, the email bounced. it came back from mx.yandex.net, which means they are using a free yandex email account.

Also, the bounce had an attachment that I refused to open.

"I won't waste time or energy sending takedowns. They'd be futile." But, dad, ya gotta try.  :doh:

R.C.
 
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Eric Thomson

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2022, 05:52:38 AM »
But, dad, ya gotta try.  :doh:

Nope. Life's too short.  grint
 
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TimothyEllis

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2022, 02:59:07 PM »
re: https://readfrom.net/

My books are available on the site, read almost 500 times!

I found this: https://readfrom.net/dmca-policy.html  and sent a request to remove to the .RU email address.

I'll let you know what happens.

R.C.

UPDATE: Of course, the email bounced. it came back from mx.yandex.net, which means they are using a free yandex email account.

Also, the bounce had an attachment that I refused to open.

"I won't waste time or energy sending takedowns. They'd be futile." But, dad, ya gotta try.  :doh:

R.C.

The instructions say send the DCMA to a street address below, (and then fails to give that address,) and send a notification of sending it to the email address.

Very obviously wordage designed to look like they take it seriously at first glance, but obviously designed for ignoring everything.

Downloading wasn't my issue with the site. Free reading online was my issue, since Amazon would have every right to assume I'm breaking their exclusivity clause with my books on that site. The downloads are the same thing, but as said, one would expect a sh*t load of malware with any download off a site like that. The online read overloads your senses with ads (all the same ad everywhere), but didn't set off my firewall.
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



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LeonardDHilleyII

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2022, 07:24:46 PM »
Quote
The instructions say send the DCMA to a street address below, (and then fails to give that address,) and send a notification of sending it to the email address.

Very obviously wordage designed to look like they take it seriously at first glance, but obviously designed for ignoring everything.

Downloading wasn't my issue with the site. Free reading online was my issue, since Amazon would have every right to assume I'm breaking their exclusivity clause with my books on that site. The downloads are the same thing, but as said, one would expect a sh*t load of malware with any download off a site like that. The online read overloads your senses with ads (all the same ad everywhere), but didn't set off my firewall.

I couldn't find any address associated with it, either. I have an ad blocker, so I didn't see any ads. Since a reader would have to 'flip' pages, that ad would be seen countless times.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2022, 07:45:28 PM by TimothyEllis »
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #24 on: January 26, 2022, 01:30:11 AM »
Returning to the thatch roof.
My experience of thatch is that it gives off a lot of dust. I should imagine that anyone on the roof would cause dust to fall  :icon_rolleyes:

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Hopscotch

Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #25 on: January 26, 2022, 01:54:55 AM »
Yep, dust.  Also falling spiders and mice.  From my experience sleeping under old thatch roofing, a villain stomping around on thatch won't fall thru but will shower occupants below with dust, dislodged spiders and startled rodents. :icon_eek: An eco-friendly alarm system.
. .
 

LeonardDHilleyII

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Re: My research in failing to answer this so if anyone knows...
« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2022, 03:32:38 AM »
Yep, dust.  Also falling spiders and mice.  From my experience sleeping under old thatch roofing, a villain stomping around on thatch won't fall thru but will shower occupants below with dust, dislodged spiders and startled rodents. :icon_eek: An eco-friendly alarm system.

I never thought of this. I like that!