Author Topic: A Quandary  (Read 431 times)

R. C.

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A Quandary
« on: November 08, 2024, 11:52:06 PM »
I wrote my latest with no intention of making it book one of a series. Of course, the ending I planned morphed, and created a massive cliffhanger.  Book two continues seamlessly from book one, using the same structural format to revisit the murders (adding context, history, and drama).

Using hindsight, the story could have been one book, well over 140k words. The market seems to prefer the 60-90k word count for the murder mystery genre.

The title of "Book One" is -- The Granite Bay Murder Club, A Nascence.

It is my desire to title "Book Two" -- The Granite Bay Murder Club, Threshold.

There's the difficulty.  The easy path: Find another name for book two. Do I? It is permitted to give two books the same title with different subtitles. Should I?

R.C.



Bill Hiatt

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2024, 12:01:16 AM »
I can't think of an obvious reason not to. In theory, you could use "Granite Bay Murder Club" as the name of the series and use the proposed subtitles as titles, but that would involve a lot more messing around with your initial cover.

I would think two short books would be better than one long one. (And I say this as someone who does have some long books in some cases.)


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Vijaya

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2024, 12:04:23 AM »
I agree with Bill. Esp. since "Club" evokes a sense of continuity--that there would be other murders in this community. And you never know--characters do take on a life of their own, but you'll have to populate them with new ones if you keep killing them off :)


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TimothyEllis

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2024, 12:06:04 AM »
You change it to a series name of The Granite Bay Murder Club

Book one becomes A Nascence.

Book 2 is then Threshold.

No subtitles involved.
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R. C.

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2024, 01:08:13 AM »
Thanks to all for the quick responses. I am creating the series The Granite Bay Murder Club.

Book One: The Granite Bay Murder Club, A Nasense.

Book Two: Secrets of the Murder Club, Release.

Or one of these options for the title of book two:

A Symphony of Shadows
Echoes of Betrayal
Echoes of Innocence
Framed by Fate
Framed in Silence
Framed Innocence
Heartbreak in Granite Bay
Loyalty's End
Memories of a Killer
Murder as Masterpiece
Secrets in the Dark
Shadows Among Us
Shadows of Deceit
The Art of Deceit
The Art of Deception
The Club of Shadows
The Dangerous Game
The Gallery of Lies
The Game of Secrets
The Granite Bay Confession <-- This is another good option.
The Price of Truth
Whispers in the Dark
Whispers of Innocence

Thoughts?

R.C.

 
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Post-Crisis D

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2024, 04:36:49 AM »
Do you plan to write a series?  That is, will there be more than two books?  Or, is this it?

If this is it, I would tend to making it one book and be done with it, especially if what is currently the first book ends on a cliffhanger.  Depending on the nature of the cliffhanger, as a reader, I might feel it was done to force me to buy the second book to see how it all works out.

If it's a one-and-done, I'd rather have a single, longer book than two books.

Also, I suppose I'm a bit meh on duologies.  A series is something.  A trilogy is something.  Two books?  I don't know.  It's like the author couldn't put in the effort to either write one really strong book or flesh out a trilogy.  Two books kind of feels like the author didn't care and if the author didn't care, why should I?  IMO, of course.
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Bill Hiatt

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2024, 12:00:34 AM »
Do you plan to write a series?  That is, will there be more than two books?  Or, is this it?

If this is it, I would tend to making it one book and be done with it, especially if what is currently the first book ends on a cliffhanger.  Depending on the nature of the cliffhanger, as a reader, I might feel it was done to force me to buy the second book to see how it all works out.

If it's a one-and-done, I'd rather have a single, longer book than two books.

Also, I suppose I'm a bit meh on duologies.  A series is something.  A trilogy is something.  Two books?  I don't know.  It's like the author couldn't put in the effort to either write one really strong book or flesh out a trilogy.  Two books kind of feels like the author didn't care and if the author didn't care, why should I?  IMO, of course.
One book would have been my personal preference, too. But, as R. C. pointed out in the first post, 140,000 words is a lot for this kind of book in the current publishing climate. Do you think the length will be off-putting. (Some genres, like epic fantasy, run longer. Others tend not to, at least from what I can see.)


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TimothyEllis

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2024, 12:04:41 AM »
There's nothing wrong with a two book series when both are about 70k each.

I used to tell LitRPG writers that it made more sense to do 2 or 3 book series than to do the doorstops they prefer to do.

They pay a lot better.
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alhawke

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2024, 01:26:10 AM »
I agree with Timothy. I tend to get more by having multiple books to sell (I regret one of my books that's 130k long--still might cut it in half).
I'd do something like this (I just jumbled your own words for flow). Whatever you do, I'd suggest keeping the words "murder club" to keep the flow of your series.


Book One: The Granite Bay Murder Club, A Nasense.

Book Two: Secrets of the Murder Club, Release.

Book Three: Shadows of the Murder Club, Confession.

 
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Post-Crisis D

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2024, 11:05:21 AM »
One book would have been my personal preference, too. But, as R. C. pointed out in the first post, 140,000 words is a lot for this kind of book in the current publishing climate. Do you think the length will be off-putting. (Some genres, like epic fantasy, run longer. Others tend not to, at least from what I can see.)

I'm still in the "a book is as long as it needs to be" camp.  If a book is a good read, do you even notice the length?  A poorly-written short book might seem long and a well-written longer book might feel short.  It depends on how good the read is and how that affects your feelings of the passage of time.  If I am enjoying reading a book, I don't read it fast.  If I'm not enjoying a book, if I continue reading it, I'm reading it at a faster rate, hoping to get to something good.

So, I don't know.  I suppose I just don't "get" judging a book based on its length.  And, for me personally, if I feel a book ends on a cliffhanger just to get me to buy the next book, while I may buy that second book, I would probably not buy another book from that author again. 

My earlier books were shorter (30k - 50k) and I did have a couple people tell me that they don't read books that short.  Okay, but so then did they buy any of my longer books?  Nope.  So, it seems like maybe word length is an excuse not to buy a book they may have had no intention of buying to begin with.  Consequently, I don't put too much stock in word length "requirements" anymore.  I mean, I will use them as a general guideline or target word count, but I'm not going to be overly particular about it.  I'd rather a book be shorter than to add fluff to hit a specific word count and I'd rather a book be longer than to cut out stuff I feel is necessary.

I think the most important thing is to write a good book, to write a book that will be enjoyable to read.  And a good book is as long as it needs to be.

Okay, so on the genre preference, it's supposedly 60k-90k, right?  So, imagine the 140k book is divided into two 70k books to meet the genre preference.  Um, what's the point?  The expectation or hope is that readers will buy the second book, right?  After all, the first book ends on a cliffhanger.  Whether you "package" the story in one book or two, the reader is still reading 140k words.  So, I ask, what the frak does it matter if those 140k words are in one book or two?  I mean, okay, you have someone say, oh, I'll only read a 60k-90k book in this genre.  But, do they only buy one book?  Or do they buy book after book?  And, if they buy book after book, they are reading more than 60k-90k words.  So, I don't get it.  If someone will read a 140k story split in two 70k books but they won't read a 140k story in one book, that person needs a smack to the head.  I mean, what's the problem?  If it's a paperback, stick a bookmark where you left off.  If it's an eBook, you can bookmark where you left off.  Will they feel better if it's sold as a "box set" which is one eBook with all the books?  At some point, you just have to say that this is stupid.  If a story is 140k words, it's 140k words whether it's put together in one 140k word book or two 70k word books.  And if there are people that will read the latter but not the former, it's just ridiculously stupid.  It's 140k words either way.

Plus, if it's not going to be a series, if it's just going to be two books, the first of which ends on a cliffhanger to get people to buy the second, just do one book and move on.
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TimothyEllis

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2024, 11:51:40 AM »
So, I don't get it.  If someone will read a 140k story split in two 70k books but they won't read a 140k story in one book, that person needs a smack to the head.  I mean, what's the problem?  If it's a paperback, stick a bookmark where you left off.  If it's an eBook, you can bookmark where you left off.  Will they feel better if it's sold as a "box set" which is one eBook with all the books?  At some point, you just have to say that this is stupid.  If a story is 140k words, it's 140k words whether it's put together in one 140k word book or two 70k word books.  And if there are people that will read the latter but not the former, it's just ridiculously stupid.  It's 140k words either way.

You're completely ignoring the math.

The 140k book won't command a higher price than the 70k will.

So if a new author, $2.99 .......... vs $2.99 + $2.99. Experienced author, $4.99 ..............vs $4.99 + $4.99.

Makes a huge difference to sales income, even if the KU is the same.

As far as cliffhanger goes, not true.

I use the 'there's got to be a morning after' principle.

You break the book where something has just been tied up, a nice little bit of aftermath, and the next challenge hasn't started yet.

In other words you get to a point midway in the story and break there, and start book 2 the next morning, the same as that next chapter was anyway.

All my series are done like this. And I rarely ever do a cliffhanger.

In any case, if the cliffhanger is there, and the next book is already on pre-order for release 1 month later, very few people care.

The only time cliff hangers are an issue is when it's going to be a year before the next book comes out.
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LilyBLily

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2024, 01:47:37 PM »
I did a women's fiction that had a natural break in the story--characters, location, a hinted thread in the first suddenly blows up in the second--as one book. I don't think people liked it, even though they expect women's fiction stories to be lengthy and splitting it into two books would have yielded two very short books. The total book was only 96k, and turning it into two 48k books just wouldn't have made anyone happy. As it was, though, neither did the longer book because people don't expect a break like that in a book anymore. When I was a kid, there were plenty of novels around that did Part 1 and Part 2. Part 2 might happen sometimes years later, if not a hemisphere away. Maybe that is done in fantasy these days but I can't think of anywhere it is typical.

My point is, if you have a natural break point, use it. If you don't, well, I guess you're stuck with one long book that you can list at $5.99 or $6.99--whatever the long fantasy novels list for--and hope for the best.

Fashions come and go.
 
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Post-Crisis D

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2024, 02:09:11 PM »
You're completely ignoring the math.

The 140k book won't command a higher price than the 70k will.

So if a new author, $2.99 .......... vs $2.99 + $2.99. Experienced author, $4.99 ..............vs $4.99 + $4.99.

Makes a huge difference to sales income, even if the KU is the same.

I'm not ignoring the math at all.  As our example, let's use $3.99 as a compromise between the new and experienced author.  So, as a reader, I either buy one book for $3.99 (though I would argue a longer book could go for higher than a shorter book) or two books at $3.99 each.  With the former, I get the full story (which is also why I would argue a higher-than-normal price point would be acceptable.  With the latter, I have to buy a second book to get the full story, which means I spend $7.98.  (Again, if the longer single book was priced at, say, $4.99, it's still a better deal for me and the author still gets some extra money.)  And there is the strong chance that I'm going to feel like you artificially split the book to force me to spend more.  As I indicated in a previous post, while I may buy that second book, the likelihood that I would ever buy a third book from that author is slim to none.

So, you can look at it as, yay, you got $7.98 by selling me two books, but that's where your math ends.  On the other hand, you might sell me one book for $3.99 (or a little higher) and if I enjoyed it, which is a full story, then I may buy another book from you, perhaps a third or a fourth or more.  So, your options are $3.99 plus $3.99 for a total of $7.98 from me buying your two books or $3.99 plus $3.99 plus $3.99 plus $3.99 and onward if I like your one book and don't feel forced to buy a second or third or fourth.
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TimothyEllis

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2024, 02:34:22 PM »
I'm not ignoring the math at all.  As our example, let's use $3.99 as a compromise between the new and experienced author.  So, as a reader, I either buy one book for $3.99 (though I would argue a longer book could go for higher than a shorter book) or two books at $3.99 each.  With the former, I get the full story (which is also why I would argue a higher-than-normal price point would be acceptable.  With the latter, I have to buy a second book to get the full story, which means I spend $7.98.  (Again, if the longer single book was priced at, say, $4.99, it's still a better deal for me and the author still gets some extra money.)  And there is the strong chance that I'm going to feel like you artificially split the book to force me to spend more.  As I indicated in a previous post, while I may buy that second book, the likelihood that I would ever buy a third book from that author is slim to none.

So, you can look at it as, yay, you got $7.98 by selling me two books, but that's where your math ends.  On the other hand, you might sell me one book for $3.99 (or a little higher) and if I enjoyed it, which is a full story, then I may buy another book from you, perhaps a third or a fourth or more.  So, your options are $3.99 plus $3.99 for a total of $7.98 from me buying your two books or $3.99 plus $3.99 plus $3.99 plus $3.99 and onward if I like your one book and don't feel forced to buy a second or third or fourth.

Why are you taking a reader perspective on this?

We're AUTHORS. This is about AUTHOR INCOME.

As far as the 'forced to buy' thing goes, what difference does it make for a series of 2, and a series of 6 or 12?

You appear to be comparing 2 serial books, with a series of non-serial stories. That's apples and oranges comparison. A pair of books and a series of 6 serial books are the same thing.

I write serial novels. Each new story starts where the last one left off, or within a few days of it. Even across series breaks normally. 82 novels now which are largely just one 4 year long story. There's no 'forced to buy' anywhere in it. People do, because it's a good story, and a new part gets released on a good schedule.

My point is, if you have a natural break point, use it. If you don't, well, I guess you're stuck with one long book that you can list at $5.99 or $6.99--whatever the long fantasy novels list for--and hope for the best.

It doesn't work that way.

Length does NOT define price.

New authors can't command more than $2.99 and realistically sell, regardless of length.

I'm at a $5.99 price point now, averaging 63k. If I put out a 200k novel now, I'd still only get $5.99 for it. Anything more, and it wouldn't sell beyond my diehard fans. And yet, 3 books with the same story would all sell at $5.99 each without any issues.

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R. C.

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2024, 10:44:42 PM »
Ah, once again, the argument most foul. Only the challenge of discussion AI raises more hackles as quickly as an effort to define marketing. 

In Make A Living Writing, there is an article titled "How to Price an Ebook: 7 Questions to Help You Decide" Item #3:

"What do similar authors charge?

You don?t have to charge the same sorts of prices as others in your genre or topic, but it pays to be aware of what?s out there, especially if your ebook will be featured in search results on a book site right alongside those competitors? offerings.

If you?re thinking a 50-page ebook about gardening is worth $20, but everyone else sells their similar-length ebooks for $2.99, you?re probably not going to see many sales. If you?re only selling off your own website, you might have more leeway to price without regard to market competition."

This is the point, many factors go into the price point for your book.

A quick search for amazon top 100 murder mystery ebooks is proof of the premise. Choose any combination of Mystery, Thriller & Suspense genre(s), and you will see the problem. Prices range from $0.99 to $19.69. When the search is limited to the K-dle store, the prices range from $0.99 to $14.99

(I didn't think you could sell an ebook on the 'Zon for more than $9.99)

The point is, what is best for your book is for you to decide.

R.C.

TimothyEllis

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2024, 11:39:27 PM »
(I didn't think you could sell an ebook on the 'Zon for more than $9.99)

Sure you can.

But over 9.99 you only get 35% royalty

Quote
The point is, what is best for your book is for you to decide.

Not really. That's what people think, and every time a forum like this gets someone who thinks their first book is worth 9.99, they always crash and burn in part because it wasn't.

What people think, and practical reality are 2 different things.

The practical reality is a first time novel commands 2.99, and that's it, regardless of length.

Kindle is full of overpriced books which never sold. It's also full of entire series being sold at 99c.

Non-fiction is different though. Then it depends on what your credentials were to write it.
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Bill Hiatt

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2024, 12:35:23 AM »
Apparently, on this particular issue, we unanimously...disagree.

On length expectations: I leave room for the possibility that they are the thinking in trad publishing rather than some natural law. That said, my urban fantasies tend to run at a more like epic fantasy length. The reviews are generally favorable, but more negative reviews do mention the length. I'm experimenting with what will happen with shorter lengths.

On pricing: Generally, an author will be able to command a higher price as the author becomes better known. While it would be logical to base pricing somewhat on length, again, I think name recognition is a bigger factor. So I might use other comparable indies as a guide if the name recognition if comparable, but it wouldn't do me any good to compare myself with Jim Butcher, who is priced higher as a series continues (Dresden Files start at $3.99 per book and end up at $7.99 per book, even though the length doesn't increase as much as the price does.) His newer series begin at $12.99. (Trads don't have to worry about the royalty restrictions we do.) To be fair, those volumes are longer and possibly more like epic fantasy--I haven't read them yet. But in terms of length, the $12.99 newer books are comparable to the $7.99 Dresden Files books. It seems that length takes a backseat to other factors, at least in the trad world.

On cliffhangers: There are readers who don't like them. How many I can't say. But I know I've dropped authors who cut off a book in mid-story. Series books, of course, have some issues left to be resolved and the potential for new problems. But each book should have a complete story arc.

Make of any of that what you will.


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PJ Post

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2024, 02:15:08 AM »
It's 2024 - not 1995. This is important to grok. Self-publishers don't sell paper, we don't sell packaging.

We sell stories.

This is so important to understand. Because stories can be published in as many installments, in as many places and even in as many different formats as we want. You could start with a short on Substack, then episode 2 is a novel available on Amazon and episode 3 is a short radio drama produced for YouTube.

One more time for clarity - we sell stories, not paper, not packaging.

___

The smart play - for both artistic AND business reasons - is more frequent shorter titles. The math is resolved. We can argue about how frequent is frequent enough and how short is short enough, but anything over 70k or so is a complete waste of resources and more specifically - time.

If I had a 140k wip, I'd rewrite it like Dickens and publish it in short chunks full up with cliffhangers; and then use social media to promote the sh*t out of it - and I'd have fun with it. I'd use it to build my brand. I'd use it to find my tribe.

As I said in another thread, your brand is your promise to your reader. If you write 140k tombs, that's what they're going to expect. If you publish short serial installments on a frequent schedule, they'll expect that.
 
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R. C.

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2024, 03:36:23 AM »
It's 2024 - not 1995. This is important to grok. Self-publishers don't sell paper, we don't sell packaging.
...
One more time for clarity - we sell stories, not paper, not packaging.
...

If that is true, why is the thumbnail size of your cover so darned important?

R.C.

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2024, 03:54:48 AM »
In response to PJ, yes and no.

Substack does provide a good avenue for serializing fiction, but, as much as I like it, only a small fraction of the total reading public is there. From what I can tell, the same is true of Wattpad and other serial platforms. So some readers like receiving fiction that way, but others may not. At best, there isn't enough evidence to judge.

Dickens was writing when books were expensive, and writers could reach a different audience through serialization. Books, particularly indie books, are relatively inexpensive, at least in their ebook iterations. As readers begin to realize that serials can be more expensive than just buying ebooks, their interest declines. That's one reason that Kindle Vella failed so hard--it wasn't a good deal.

Free serials and shorts, of course, are a better deal, but are paid subs on a place like Substack more economical than purchases? Substack is a pay by month or year operation, rather than a pay by episode system, so there's a good chance it can be less expensive than Vella was. But whether it's cheaper than buying ebooks depends on how much the same author would charge for ebooks and how often the author releases new titles. Using a $50 per year subscription as an example (even though some people charge a lot more), if a relatively new author charged $2.99 per ebook, that author would have to produce almost 17 books per year to make the Substack subscription an economical alternative to purchasing books. That's almost a book and a half a month, or about the rate at which Timothy produces, so it's possible, but for a slower writer, it would be tough. A writer selling for $4.99 would have an easier time, needing to only produce about ten books in a year to have readers reach the break-even point. That's still a lot for many writers.

The economics are clearer on the writer's side. Writers get 80% of the subscription income they generate on Substack, so our hypothetical author would make $40 in the first scenario, compared to $35.58 or so in ebook royalties. In the second scenario, the writer would make even less on royalties ($34.91).

So that all seems like a good deal for writers--but the situation is actually more complicated than that. Even getting free subscriptions is like pulling teeth, and getting paid is even more difficult. I'm by no means a huge seller, but I made approximately 58 times more on ebook sales (not counting paperback sales or KU pages read) in October than I made on Substack subscriptions during the month of October. This is after spending a huge number of hours starting on March 1 or so on Substack, building community in various ways. Sure, I spent a fair amount on AMS ads to get those sales, but if we value my time at any reasonable figure, I probably spent more on Substack in terms of total resources.

Even though Substack is a subscription-oriented venue, I earned more from Substackers buying my books than I did from subscriptions.

Could I be atypical? Yes, I could. But I know a lot of people whose story is similar, except that they have fewer sales on other venues. Even some of the gurus are saying that if you have a thousand subs, of which three are paid, you're doing well. Speaking of which, the people who make the most money on Substack are nonfiction writers who provide a service for authors. (Sound familiar?), as well as celebrities of various sorts, including bestselling authors. Joe Average Indie, on the other hand, is typically not doing that.

Don't get me wrong. Substack is great for community. It's far superior to the how-much-money-can-we-make-selling-advertising type social media. It doesn't require a cash investment and can act as a substitute for mailing list and website for authors on a budget. It can also produce supplemental income, though maybe not a whole lot.

What it doesn't do is prove that there are a huge number of readers clamoring for serialized fiction, particularly not as an alternative to book buying. It does appeal to readers who are looking for a unique selection of material, a lot of which they can't find elsewhere. It also appeals to the fans of celebrities who are there. But it doesn't yet have a large audience of people willing to pay for serialized fiction. And those that are willing may have relatively low budgets, so they aren't going to be subscribing to that many authors. The same readers might buy ebooks from a more varied range of people.

Books will in many cases be cheaper than serialized fiction (in contrast to the Dickens era pricing). Even were that not the case, readers who weren't anti-Amazon could get a better deal from KU. Yeah, it's  $144.88 a year, but for less than three paid subs on Substack, a reader could have access to the work of thousands of authors, rather than just three. You can see where I'm going with that.

None of that means that people shouldn't serialize. It just means that it's not necessarily an avenue to success.


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alhawke

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2024, 05:08:35 AM »
Cutting down the size of my books has saved money. It is the "math".  I try to release novels that are around 55 to 60k in size these days. This might not "fit" the recommended length with the genre in the industry, but as long as I provide a complete story, readers have not complained. The shorter books have done great.

Cutting size cuts down editing and narrating costs (if I convert to audiobook). And many readers buy series books in bulk. I also can sell new releases faster. I think the only concern with length is expectations. If you cut the story unnaturally, or don't provide a full yarn, it's like a bad cliffhanger. You're gonna leave readers upset with their purchase.
 
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PJ Post

Re: A Quandary
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2024, 09:28:02 AM »
If you cut the story unnaturally, or don't provide a full yarn, it's like a bad cliffhanger. You're gonna leave readers upset with their purchase.

This.

___

If that is true, why is the thumbnail size of your cover so darned important?

Messaging. 

It's how we get new fans, but also how we get existing fans excited. Covers are marketing. They let the world know what we're doing here - in three seconds or less.

___

In response to PJ, yes and no.

I see Substack as social media, and an additional revenue stream - not an only revenue stream.

Also, I wasn't giving specific strategic advice, I was advocating outside the box thinking - that we can do whatever our brand allows for. More specifically, that we shouldn't be limited by outdated traditional publishing ideas. Traditional publishing sells the paper the words are printed on, not the words themselves. Music labels sell CD's, literally the plastic disc, which is the packaging medium, not the music itself. Streaming services sell access, also not the music.

Self-publishers sell the words, the story, fleeting intangible emotion - thrills and spills, as they used to say. We sell experience. And there are no limitations on how we do it.
 
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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2024, 10:30:28 PM »

If that is true, why is the thumbnail size of your cover so darned important?

Messaging. 

It's how we get new fans, but also how we get existing fans excited. Covers are marketing. They let the world know what we're doing here - in three seconds or less.


Messaging is another word for marketing. Marketing is the packaging of a message. The message we are marketing is that we write good stories. We craft messages to create a market for the sale of the work that we put on "paper."

R.C.

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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2024, 11:22:38 PM »
PJ, what I was saying yes and no about was
Quote
If I had a 140k wip, I'd rewrite it like Dickens and publish it in short chunks full up with cliffhangers; and then use social media to promote the sh*t out of it - and I'd have fun with it. I'd use it to build my brand. I'd use it to find my tribe.
Short chunks sounds like a serial, and I think earlier in the thread, you alluded to serializing on Substack.

There's nothing wrong with trying out a serial venue, and Substack is probably the best one out there at the moment. I'm just saying that people seem to still be more interesting in buying books than they are in reading serials. Substack's social media function works far better than its revenue function for most authors.

I know that my own personal tastes run that way. I'd rather read a novel from beginning to end, then go on to the next novel. Frankly, having to keep up with multiple serials (to be supportive of other authors) confuses me. I do it precisely because I want to be supportive, but it ends up not being the kind of immersive reading experience that I like.


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Re: A Quandary
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2024, 11:28:15 PM »
Cutting down the size of my books has saved money. It is the "math".  I try to release novels that are around 55 to 60k in size these days. This might not "fit" the recommended length with the genre in the industry, but as long as I provide a complete story, readers have not complained. The shorter books have done great.

Cutting size cuts down editing and narrating costs (if I convert to audiobook). And many readers buy series books in bulk. I also can sell new releases faster. I think the only concern with length is expectations. If you cut the story unnaturally, or don't provide a full yarn, it's like a bad cliffhanger. You're gonna leave readers upset with their purchase.
Sound advice!

The one thing I will say is that editing costs depend on the editor or editorial service used. For instance, I use Kirkus, which does use a per-word rate but also has a per title fee (perhaps to keep them from being flooded with short stories). So for me, producing smaller volumes would be more expensive in editing terms--same word count in the long run, but more title fees. That said, the advantage of having a more rapid release would probably make up for that, and I'm thinking in those terms with my current WIP.


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