The dreaded comma splice!

[TimothyEllis]

In other news, it appears we've moved on to the subject of the nonessential clause. 

In other news, it appears we've moved on, to the subject of the nonessential clause. 

[Jeff Tanyard]

In other news, it appears we've moved on to the subject of the nonessential clause. 

In other news, it appears we've moved on, to the subject of the nonessential clause. 

[notthatamanda]

Not to blow this discussion up too much, but I just sent these three examples to one of the 50 folk kindly alpha-reading my latest. (Not examples of fine writing, or even sentences I would use, and I only put them out there to discuss the 'commas around and' issue.)

I believe (although I'm not certain) that the first is technically correct, but it has too many pauses for me.
The second sounds better to me when I hear the words in my head.
The third makes me want to gouge my eyes out.


Septimus pressed the button, and, with a smile, he opened the door.
Septimus pressed the button and, with a smile, he opened the door.
Septimus pressed the button, and with a smile, he opened the door.


Some might write 'Septimus pressed the button and opened the door with a smile' - no thanks, I prefer my doors serious.

Just to be a contrarian, the third is the only sentence of the bunch I can stand to look at. :D Two sentences joined with a conjunction and a necessary comma, and a clause in the second sentence, separated by a comma.

Is that what it is? 

I would never put a comma after an and, always before.

Putting the comma after the and breaks the flow of the sentence completely. For me, anyway.

I hear my elementary school teacher saying, "Use commas where you would parenthesis," so #2 looks the most correct to me.

Probably I would break it up to be:

Septimus pressed the button and smiled. When the buzzer rang, he opened the door.

[TimothyEllis]

Septimus pressed the button and smiled. When the buzzer rang, he opened the door.

Winner. 

[Simon Haynes]

Probably I would break it up to be:

Septimus pressed the button and smiled. When the buzzer rang, he opened the door.

Oh yes, I agree entirely. My approach is always 'reword reword' instead of faffing around with Ye Olde Rules of Commas. I'm certainly not going to leaf through Elements of Style for 20 mins if I can just spend five seconds editing the sentence on the fly - avoiding the problem altogether.

[notthatamanda]

Septimus pressed the button and smiled. When the buzzer rang, he opened the door.

Winner. 

Thanks I needed that today.

[PJ Post]

I don't get all the fuss. It's Art. We can do whatever we want.

I resolve this issue by using Word's reading aloud function. If it sounds wonky when read aloud, it sounds wonky when read silently - so, I add punctuation as necessary, including commas, to create pauses. I do the same thing to slow down a sentence or to give a moment space or signal its importance. With the proliferation of reading apps, this is probably an approach worth considering.

[Lynn]

PJ is the winner. That's what I do: what I want. ;)

[notthatamanda]

If I came across as trying to convince others that I am right, I apologize. Mostly I am just procrastinating here.

[Luke Everhart]

I don't get all the fuss. It's Art. We can do whatever we want.

I resolve this issue by using Word's reading aloud function. If it sounds wonky when read aloud, it sounds wonky when read silently

Well... for me, to the extent it's art it's commercial art; so, no, if I want to keep the commercial part in there with its implications of lots of people wanting to pay for it, then I can't do whatever I want. Personally, though, I don't really think of commercial/genre fiction books as art (though I do think of literary books more that way). I think of them as entertainment, the 'E' in 'A&E'.
(Of course this is all hypothetical for me since I've yet to pull the trigger and actually publish so... 🤷‍♂️ It'll happen though! I'm just juggling another entrepreneurial venture right now so it's slowed things down a lot.)

I do think using audio playbook of a book is a good way to see how it reads mentally to fine tune it. 👍

[Lynn]

There are grammar rules I follow when it suits me and rules I don't follow unless it suits me.

What matters most to me is:
1. Clarity
2. Reading ease
3. Emotion

I use comma splices when I feel they're the right thing to use. And technically, comma splices are allowed in some instances anyway even within the rules.

According to Garner's Modern English Usage: [M]ost usage authorities accept comma splices when (1) the clauses are short and closely related, (2) there is no danger of a miscue, and (3) the context is informal [...] But even when all three criteria are met, some readers are likely to object.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_splice

My little Harbrace College Handbook of old says the same thing.

Either a comma or a semicolon may be used between short main clauses ... when the clauses are parallel in form and unified in thought

This is not meant to educate anyone, btw. LOL. I just want to contribute to the conversation. :D

[Anarchist]

I don't get all the fuss. It's Art. We can do whatever we want.

For me, it's business.

But I agree with you. I'll happily sacrifice pedantry on the alter of readability.

[R. C.]

I don't get all the fuss. It's Art. We can do whatever we want.

For me, it's business.

But I agree with you. I'll happily sacrifice pedantry on the alter of readability.

Pedantry Noun

ped·​ant·​ry | \ ˈpe-dᵊn-trē ... \
plural pedantries
Definition of pedantry
1: pedantic presentation or application of knowledge or learning
2: an instance of pedantry

Pedantic Adjective

pe·​dan·​tic | \ pi-ˈdan-tik ... \
Definition of pedantic
1: of, relating to, or being a pedant
    a pedantic teacher
2: narrowly, stodgily, and often ostentatiously learned
    a pedantic insistence that we follow the rules exactly
    Far worse, he was pedantic, pernickety, letting nothing inaccurate or of uncertain meaning go by—not an aphrodisiac quality.
— Kingsley Amis
3: UNIMAGINATIVE, DULL
    Pedantic song choices don't help any. Only 2 out of 10 songs stray from the most common classic-rock fodder. — Jim Farber

Love me some Marriam-Webster. (Emphasis added.)

For those who do not see the humor herein, I request, with fervor, you unclench with a nice little review of that which is important.

Of course, dear friends, I could shorten these streams of connective thought, but where is the joy in not possessing an aphrodisiac qualities?

Cheers,
R. C.