Effects of AMS bidding

[JRTomlin]

I have seen this debated and am still not sure of my own opinion.

How much benefit is there to bidding high? Does your ad receive more views? Does being on the first page raise click-throughs?

You'd think that 'yes' would be self-evident, but I've received a lot of clicks both bidding low and bidding high, and I'm not sure if bidding high raised them that much. 🤔

Maybe someone more mathematically inclined than me (not hard) has done some calculations. Any thoughts anyone?

[LilyBLily]

Someone said a couple of years ago that anyone who is looking at pages 2 to infinity is in the mood to buy/read. This should give us all hope if we can't afford to bid high enough to be on page 1.

Based on what I recently read about tracking even when one is supposedly incognito browsing, I know of no way to be sure that the seeming position of my ad when I look at its category is not being biased by Amazon--other than to ask someone to look at it for me on their computer. And then never ask that person again, since the next attempt would show bias.

I haven't done the testing that some have, so I have no numbers or conclusive evidence to share.

[dgcasey]

I have come to think that bidding yourself onto page one has little effect, except for those readers that don't click to page two and on. It really shouldn't make a difference if your ad shows on page one or page ten, if it does actually show. If I'm getting 10,000 impressions a day on an ad, I don't really care what page it's on because it did pass in front of someone's eyes. And would I rather pay .20 cents for an impression on page ten or pay $1.50 for page one?

[notthatamanda]

I can't say I've done hard calculations but I've experimented and I believe the bid amount is only one of the factors. A book on page one is more likely to sell, maybe not a lot more, but it has the first chance to catch someone's eye. The algos are going to factor how likely they think your book will sell and how much Amazon stands to make from the sale. This may be based on the individual viewers buying habits, or not. Amazon will show me tons of ads on KU books and I'm not in KU. Maybe they are trying to influence me to give KU a try.

Just guesses, the actual algorithm is probably far more complicated and changing all the time.

Edit - I have to take part of that back. The KU banners are showing on the also boughts but not on the sponsored ads. When did that happen? I don't think that is good at all. I don't want someone who wants a KU book clicking on my ad.  I'm in panic mode again.

[JRTomlin]

I have come to think that bidding yourself onto page one has little effect, except for those readers that don't click to page two and on. It really shouldn't make a difference if your ad shows on page one or page ten, if it does actually show. If I'm getting 10,000 impressions a day on an ad, I don't really care what page it's on because it did pass in front of someone's eyes. And would I rather pay .20 cents for an impression on page ten or pay $1.50 for page one?

That's a great point.

I can't say I've done hard calculations but I've experimented and I believe the bid amount is only one of the factors. A book on page one is more likely to sell, maybe not a lot more, but it has the first chance to catch someone's eye. The algos are going to factor how likely they think your book will sell and how much Amazon stands to make from the sale. This may be based on the individual viewers buying habits, or not. Amazon will show me tons of ads on KU books and I'm not in KU. Maybe they are trying to influence me to give KU a try.

Just guesses, the actual algorithm is probably far more complicated and changing all the time.

Edit - I have to take part of that back. The KU banners are showing on the also boughts but not on the sponsored ads. When did that happen? I don't think that is good at all. I don't want someone who wants a KU book clicking on my ad.  I'm in panic mode again.

I would take a hard look at your targeting then to be sure you're not accidentally targetting them. But if they're in your AB list, it is just showing that people who read KU books also buy your books. Turn off panic mode. People in KU do buy books as well, you know. 😜

Edit: What kind of targeting do you do? There are several targetting methods, some narrower than others. My own targeting is very narrow and focused because I definitely don't want people who want historical romances or more modern HF to click on my ads. But some people successfully do broader targeting.

[twicebitten]

I can find one site that claims 22% will scroll to the end/bottom  of a page. It doesn't suggest how long that page or list might be, but surely there's an end point, don't you think? Here's a chart: https://www.advancedwebranking.com/ctrstudy/ I'd imagine the principles are similar for AMS ads. There are a bunch of options there--you can look in category, by intent, and whatnot. I did that, trying to make it as specific as possible for books. Bottom line: be in the top 10 or forget it.

People reach a limit of clicking or scrolling. It seems to be age-dependent to some extent, so your reader demographic matters. (Older people will click/swipe more.) Whatever Amazon decides to do on designing the look for phones, tablets, and browsers will significantly impact us. They now show on my browser top 50 books in any category all at once. Back when, they showed 20. So that's a real win if you're in the 21-50 range. That range and a cover that pops? Good news for you the writer.

Phones and smaller screen space mean a lot of times, three books/ads show at a time upon arrival to a page. So you want to be in top 3. However, easier-to-work sliders make scrolling simple. I can find some info online that says if you have to click to see more results, you opt out of clicking quicker than if you have to swipe. (like, Average Joe will click one time, but not more, but he'll swipe four times.)

[notthatamanda]

I have come to think that bidding yourself onto page one has little effect, except for those readers that don't click to page two and on. It really shouldn't make a difference if your ad shows on page one or page ten, if it does actually show. If I'm getting 10,000 impressions a day on an ad, I don't really care what page it's on because it did pass in front of someone's eyes. And would I rather pay .20 cents for an impression on page ten or pay $1.50 for page one?

That's a great point.

I can't say I've done hard calculations but I've experimented and I believe the bid amount is only one of the factors. A book on page one is more likely to sell, maybe not a lot more, but it has the first chance to catch someone's eye. The algos are going to factor how likely they think your book will sell and how much Amazon stands to make from the sale. This may be based on the individual viewers buying habits, or not. Amazon will show me tons of ads on KU books and I'm not in KU. Maybe they are trying to influence me to give KU a try.

Just guesses, the actual algorithm is probably far more complicated and changing all the time.

Edit - I have to take part of that back. The KU banners are showing on the also boughts but not on the sponsored ads. When did that happen? I don't think that is good at all. I don't want someone who wants a KU book clicking on my ad.  I'm in panic mode again.

I would take a hard look at your targeting then to be sure you're not accidentally targetting them. But if they're in your AB list, it is just showing that people who read KU books also buy your books. Turn off panic mode. People in KU do buy books as well, you know. 😜

Edit: What kind of targeting do you do? There are several targetting methods, some narrower than others. My own targeting is very narrow and focused because I definitely don't want people who want historical romances or more modern HF to click on my ads. But some people successfully do broader targeting.

I do purposely target some books in KU, my best currently running campaign is on a 99 cent KU book and people buy my full price book. I've even sold a couple of full priced hardcovers on that campaign. But I'd rather the KU reader who won't buy a book knows before they click on my ad that it's not in KU.

I know Amazon is going to change up how the page looks, if only because the longer the page looks the same, the more people are going to skim over it. Constant change is needed to make them really look at it. I'm just not crazy about this change, though the panic thing was mostly poking fun at myself.

Oh and my targeting is pretty narrow. Bidding on categories was expensive and slightly less effective than narrower targeting.

[JRTomlin]

There is a KU banner above KU book ads so people should realise before they click if that isn't there. If I happen to be looking for a KU book, as I sometimes do, that's what I look for.

I do bid on 'medieval mystery' for one of my campaigns but that is pretty narrow. Otherwise, I just don't any more at all. Like you, I've found it just doesn't pay.

[notthatamanda]

That's my point, the KU banner in the sponsored ad carousel are gone. I poked around this morning, double checking books that came up in the first spot for sponsored ads on the carousel, for romance. No banner on the carousel, when you go to the book, it is in KU.  (I didn't click on the ads cause I didn't want to cost people money I just searched them.)

Now I'm starting to think it was never there. But I'm sure it was.  Was it?

[JRTomlin]

Yikes! I'll have a look. They were there for me yesterday but that doesn't mean it hasn't changed since.

ETA: You're right. They are gone! That is bad, very bad. They are there (so far) on my AB list but taking them off the ads is a dreadful idea!

[notthatamanda]

Thanks, I think I'm losing it.  I know, I know, what else is new, but...

[JRTomlin]

No, you're not losing it. Unless I'm losing it, they were there for me yesterday. But gone today. Just... why?

ETA: I just recently decided to put my medieval mysteries back in KU instead of wide since they didn't do that well wide and mysteries generally do well in KU. Now (if this is permanent) we won't be able to advertise being in KU which pretty much does away with the point.

I am dumbstruck by this change.

[notthatamanda]

I think it could piss off the KU readers, but most of the top ads are probably in KU anyway.

Are you going to do a boxset on the mysteries? It seems like the thing to do? You don't have to answer, I just like to torture myself with the idea of going back to KU but I am not doing that, but if I did I have compilations ready to go, but romance is too competitive ya dummy (at myself).

[JRTomlin]

Believe me, I regret that I did go back to KU even in a limited way. Stupid, stupid decision.

I should do a box set, I know. I keep putting it off while I do other things. lol

[Pyram King]

I just started my AMS ads today on my new book.
Have a few campaigns started - so we will see.
I set them all to .21 with the up/down option.

I watched the free kindleprenuer video - so that is the extent of my knowledge. https://courses.kindlepreneur.com/courses/AMS
Will let you know how it goes.

[R. C.]

re: Will let you know how it goes.

I would love to hear/read the results.

Cheers,
R.C.