Author Topic: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub  (Read 33917 times)

LilyBLily

Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« on: February 19, 2021, 02:45:28 AM »
On the ever helpful partners blog, BookBub gives nine reasons a book was rejected:

https://insights.bookbub.com/reasons-book-rejected-bookbub-featured-deal

My problem is #7--not enough platform, specifically reviews. So we have that famous chicken-egg conundrum: Not enough sales to interest BookBub in increasing my books' sales, not enough reviews to interest BookBub in increasing my books' review count.

I guess I can use that thousand dollars I won't be spending on a BookBub ad for a lot of Facebook ads or something. Or maybe I'm supposed to hunt up and pay for a couple hundred reviews. That's a great use of ad money, just give the book away to a thousand people and hope I get a hundred new reviews. Or two hundred. Actually, it's hard to find a service that can give away that many books on the direct hope/assumption the recipient will review it. Straight book giveaways have not worked for me at all; I can give away a couple thousand books and get zero reviews.

Last week I had 23 requests for a free copy of one of my titles through a company that says it has a 75% review rate. So far, no new reviews. In my personal experience, if I don't read a book as soon as I download it, I probably won't read it ever, so I am not hopeful that 75% will apply to my book.

I'm committed to asking BookBub once a month every month this year, anyway. They might have an off moment and want my thousand dollars after all.
 
The following users thanked this post: Thorvald Meyers

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2021, 02:56:55 AM »
I just applied today too. It's kind of a hail Mary at this point.
 

Anarchist

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2021, 03:49:48 AM »
Nobody wants to be the first to arrive at a party. If a book has few reviews, few people will feel inclined to leave one.

One reason is exposure. Another is apathy.

If you have an ultra-responsive audience on a mailing list, you can launch and see 100+ reviews within a week (or even a couple days). Or you can rely on an ARC list. Or better still, do both.

If you can launch with 100 reviews, new readers will feel inclined to leave reviews. Once the book receives several hundred reviews, and assuming it continues to sell well, the reviews really start to pile in.

Having said that, I have no plans to submit to BB in the near future. I had one a couple years ago. It did well. I made money. But of course, the tail gradually eroded over the following weeks.

Today, I spend nearly all of my advertising time and money on AMS.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: there is never enough of anything to fully satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics.” – Thomas Sowell

"The State is an institution run by gangs of murderers, plunderers and thieves, surrounded by willing executioners, propagandists, sycophants, crooks, liars, clowns, charlatans, dupes and useful idiots—an institution that dirties and taints everything it touches.” - Hans Hoppe

"Virtue is more to be feared than vice, because its excesses are not subject to the regulation of conscience." - Adam Smith

Nothing that requires the labor of others is a basic human right.

I keep a stiff upper lip and shoot from the hip. - AC/DC
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2021, 04:31:59 AM »
The lack of reviews is a bit misleading. I've had bookbubs on a box set with 4 reviews, and bookbubs on single books with less than 20 (and at the time, a 3.5 average to boot. It was the first part of a trilogy, and a few people whinged that it was the first part of a trilogy.)

Keep applying is my advice. It costs nothing except a few minutes of your time.

 
The following users thanked this post: Seoulite, Thorvald Meyers

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2021, 09:27:19 AM »
I've had a book with only 3 reviews land on BookBub. I've applied around 30x and been accepted 3x over the past 2 yrs (2 LGBT (one intl only); 1 sci-fi).

Two things I'd  consider. They're expensive. Yes you get a ton of sales, but you're paying for it. A sci fi BB cost me over $750. My budgeting last year put me in the doldrums this week (it's tax time).

Another is predictability. You can't focus your marketing on them because they might or might not take you.

I'm usually accepted when I really don't expect to be. Case in point was my sci fi one. I really thought they would never accept the book. It had 23 reviews. But they did. A year before that I was accepted with 3 reviews AFTER I already did a launch promotion sale a month before. The BB was powerful enough to still be worth it the following month.

Keep applying. It doesn't hurt. And whatever the situation, it's always worth it (if you can afford it). It's certainly fun to watch 2 or 3 sales come in within one minute in the morning.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2021, 04:01:53 PM »
I've applied 23 times since 2018, and I've been accepted 6 times. Of those I think 3 were international only.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2021, 09:54:32 PM »
Applied 80 times, accepted twice, intl only. The second one I didn't even make back the $200 bucks it cost me.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2021, 02:56:35 AM »
Based on where my sales usually happen, I don't see international as a significant market for any of my fiction. The international ad that BookBub occasionally may offer to some people won't be useful to me. I'm not going to apply for it. I don't need another disappointing and expensive ad experience.



 

 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2021, 04:45:18 AM »
Bear in mind humour+sf and humour+fantasy are relatively niche genres. The number of authors active in those genres would be in the low double digits - like 15-20 at a guess, and many of them only seem to have one or two books.

If you write and publish in a genre with a lot more competition, I'd imagine that it's much harder to get a bookbub. In their information pages, they mention that they consider how recently they promoted a similar title to the one being submitted.


 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2021, 07:56:07 AM »
Contemporary romance (I don't think BookBub even has a Western contemporary romance category) is hugely competitive. I've occasionally submitted a contemporary but am not surprised those have been turned down.

These days I only submit women's fiction, which is also very competitive. All my women's fiction is wide. I've been building up my list and later this year will actually turn some of my women's fiction into a soft series. By that I mean something similar to "A Lowcountry Novel" or "A Southern Novel" as a subtitle. Possibly with a number but maybe not. I'm not ready to investigate that yet.


 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #10 on: February 20, 2021, 09:04:55 AM »
Bookbubs are (mostly) awesome. Some people have misses with niche genres or the international-only, but generally speaking, they're still good. My first Bookbub was one of those unforgettable experiences (like the first orange bestseller flag, or the first time in the top 1000 ranking, or the first sale to someone who isn't your mate or your mum). I've had 9 altogether, and they've all done well. The last one was on 26th December, just two weeks after a new release, and the tail from that is still going strong and will probably last to the next release in three weeks.

My genre (Regency romance) is less competitive than some because they tend to have two every day, one free and one at 99c, so there's twice as many chances to get in. When I was trying to flog my epic fantasies, there was only one of those a day, and not every day, so there's far less of a shot at it. I don't have any particular tips, except that I've had a much better acceptance rate since I stopped applying routinely and only tried every three months or so. It took me 60 tries to get my first, but now I get accepted every two or three tries. It's definitely worth persevering!

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #11 on: February 20, 2021, 03:18:11 PM »
I'm still chasing a first bookbub for my middle-grade series.  I know it's a very small market (you can tell by the cost of a worldwide BB in that category), but I'm stubborn.  The paperbacks for that series have been flying out for the past 3-4 months, mostly due to my AMS efforts in the UK and US, but it would still be nice to give the series a kick up the charts.

I've never applied for a BB with my mil SF or gaslamp fantasy books. Both have 2 books out with a series of 3 planned, and both of those unwritten books are next in my plans. I sort of wanted to wait until there were three before I applied for a BB, to maximise sellthrough, but if I got a BB on either it would be all the motivation I needed to leap into writing #3.


 
The following users thanked this post: PaulineMRoss

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2021, 12:18:22 AM »
I think there's a downward trend in all the paid newsletters promos and it may be as simple as people lost interest in them.
 
The following users thanked this post: R. C.

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2021, 12:28:47 AM »
I think there's a downward trend in all the paid newsletters promos and it may be as simple as people lost interest in them.

I would hazard that the market is over-saturated with newsletter promos at this point. Everyone and his dancing banana is launching a new promo service every two minutes, hoping it's the path to easy riches. I know I get a lot of them, and read perhaps 10%, if that, and only if something catches my eye.
 
The following users thanked this post: Thorvald Meyers

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2021, 01:29:25 AM »
Oh I agree. So many paid newsletters.

What discount strategy with Google ads, if you don't mind me asking. Using google promo codes? I'm thinking of using those for the first time to discount my WWII book as the sequel will be released in April.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2021, 01:58:24 AM »
Thanks for the response. Yes google play promo codes. On the dash for google play you have access to this:

Create promo codes to offer customers a free or discounted book without lowering the book’s list price. Learn more about this new marketing tool.

I haven't investigated it fully yet. I'm planning on using my personal mailing list to email a promo code for my WWII book to see if I can jump start something that way.

I'm kind of mixing together google play and google ads, sorry.  Google ads question - can you set your bid on google ads to what ever you want? I had trouble with that when I tried google ads, going on 2 years ago.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2021, 02:29:53 AM »
I think there's a downward trend in all the paid newsletters promos and it may be as simple as people lost interest in them.
I think people tire with the day to day subscriptions. My thing is gathering all the email promotions every morning and clicking delete. I'm subscribed to about eight of them. It's not that I'm not interested, sometimes I browse, I like to do it, particularly the BookBubs, it's just ...
And I'm sure I'm not the only one.

But we all know BookBub tends to be worth our time. I contacted a new cover artist after admiring a cover a couple months ago from a BB email.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2021, 03:39:00 AM »
Just curious. Is there a reason why you will only offer discounts to Google Play customers, or do you plan to have a similar promo style offer for all platforms? I've never used promo codes, so I don't know if every platform has the same kind of code.

I've set Google Ads as low as $5 a day (you can go lower) and I doubt there is an upper limit. ;)

If you're having trouble setting it up, I recommend you contact Google support and ask for a marketing appointment. The Google person will call you at the time you nominate and ask you share screen access (it's an online Google meeting, so they can see your screen and guide you step-by-step -- the call center is in India and the guy I spoke to was very helpful).

I don't tend to launch books anymore. I run a continuous campaign one way or another and it's not expensive. There seems to be a baseline of sales I get without doing anything and campaigns bump up those sales -- the usual thing, the more I promote, the more I sell.
My understanding of it is it is a Google play promo code. It won't work anywhere else. I just did my first email list mailing ever a couple of weeks ago and sent my list a promo code for Kobo. Since it is a promo code you don't have to lower the prices on the platform or worry about getting matched by Amazon. I have only ever sent one email to my 13 email list subscribers so I am by no means an expert.

I assume when you say $5/day for the google ad you are talking about the campaign budget. I was never able to set the actual bid amount. Do you mind sharing how you do that? From what I remember you could bid 42 cents or let google pick it, but I may be remembering it wrong.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2021, 04:19:49 AM »
Cheap = less than 42 cents? I will have to get back into the google ad dash and poke around. Not today, but thank you for your help.
 

R. C.

  • Long Novel unlocked
  • ***
  • Posts: 973
  • Thanked: 320 times
  • Gender: Male
  • "Sooner barbarity than boredom." - T. Gautier
    • Ruairí Cinéad Ducantlin - Writer of Stories
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2021, 04:55:31 AM »
...
For some reason, Google Ads doesn't work the same in Firefox.  This is based on using Edge.
...

I don't know about Edge but I can tell you, with certainty, Google Ads DOES NOT present the same all the time.

I use Chrome for Google Ads and have come to one rule: When in doubt use CTRL-F5.

Every time I CTRL-F5 the refreshed page updates with corrected numbers.  In "sub-menus" the menu options are hit-and-miss: CTRL-F5.

I find Google ADs very difficult to use, obtuse, and designed to eat budgets.  Their "recommendations" and "suggestions" are so far out in left field, they are pointless.

Cheers,
R.C.

P.S. - Out in left field is an Americanism derived from Baseball. It means way the heck over there!

P.P.S. - I have to turn OFF my VPN to get Google ADs to work at all.

↓↓↓ Latest Creation ↓↓↓
 

 
R.C. Ducantlin
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2021, 06:08:01 AM »
I just applied today too. It's kind of a hail Mary at this point.
Rejected. 24 hours from submission to rejection and they emailed me on a Saturday.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2021, 08:40:30 AM »
I just applied today too. It's kind of a hail Mary at this point.
Rejected. 24 hours from submission to rejection and they emailed me on a Saturday.

 :icon_sad:

They do their newsletter seven days a week so someone must have a Saturday shift. I wonder if there's any variation in acceptances on weekends, the way there's a variance at Amazon on what is erotica or what can't be on an ad?
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #22 on: February 22, 2021, 04:11:27 PM »
Applied 80 times, accepted twice, intl only. The second one I didn't even make back the $200 bucks it cost me.
So, does international mean the rest of the world but not the USA?

I've never applied for a Bookbub, but the thing that bothers me about that list is the page count thing. Amazon have a strange idea of page count; my latest book's kindle version shows more than a hundred pages less than the identical print version. Every time I have to write to Amazon asking them to match the page count properly.

I'm also bothered by the cost. And is it really worth it any more? I mean, now we have Facebook ads and Amazon ads and even Bookbub itself are selling ad space, is the featured deal the golden egg it was to start with?

Having read the requirements, I am not about to go wide for anyone. I make a vast majority of my income from page reads. I tried wide before a couple of times and got absolutely nowhere.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 04:18:15 PM by Doglover »
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #23 on: February 22, 2021, 04:25:57 PM »
Just looking at the Bookbub submission. It is asking me if I publish my audio books traditionally or independently. I have no idea what that means. I publish through ACX; which one is that?

They go on a lot about covers, yet the covers on their home page for readers are not my idea of wonderful.
 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #24 on: February 22, 2021, 07:18:19 PM »
Just looking at the Bookbub submission. It is asking me if I publish my audio books traditionally or independently. I have no idea what that means. I publish through ACX; which one is that?

Traditionally means you have a deal with someone like Podium or Tantor to produce your audiobooks. Independently means you got it done yourself, either paying upfront or royalty share.

I'm also bothered by the cost. And is it really worth it any more? I mean, now we have Facebook ads and Amazon ads and even Bookbub itself are selling ad space, is the featured deal the golden egg it was to start with?

For me, the answer is unequivocally YES. A Bookbub featured deal for my genre (historical romance) for a free book is under $500, and for the last one I made that back in a couple of days from ebook sales, page reads and audio sales. I'm still seeing a distinct tail 8 weeks later. That's a particularly good result, but even a bad Bookbub is hugely profitable for me.

BUT it does vary by genre and by particular book/author, and there's general agreement that a Bookbub is not what it was in the heady days of 5 or 6 years ago. It used to be a career maker. Now, it's just a very profitable promotion (at best). You really won't know until you try it. And you don't have to be wide, but in some genres it's almost impossible to get one unless you are.


Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2021, 09:50:47 PM »
Applied 80 times, accepted twice, intl only. The second one I didn't even make back the $200 bucks it cost me.
So, does international mean the rest of the world but not the USA?

I've never applied for a Bookbub, but the thing that bothers me about that list is the page count thing. Amazon have a strange idea of page count; my latest book's kindle version shows more than a hundred pages less than the identical print version. Every time I have to write to Amazon asking them to match the page count properly.

I'm also bothered by the cost. And is it really worth it any more? I mean, now we have Facebook ads and Amazon ads and even Bookbub itself are selling ad space, is the featured deal the golden egg it was to start with?

Having read the requirements, I am not about to go wide for anyone. I make a vast majority of my income from page reads. I tried wide before a couple of times and got absolutely nowhere.
An Intl only is the UK, India, Australia and Canada.

If you have audiobooks I did make my money back on a Findaway/Chirp/Bookbub. I would do that again, except I'm not doing audio again for a while. Those you submit through Findaway.
 

Crystal

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #26 on: February 26, 2021, 05:08:27 AM »
BookBub is really not the career maker it once was. I had some 2016 BookBubs that made 3-20x their fee, but in the last few years, my BookBubs have mostly broken even or, maybe, made 2x their fee. The sellthrough just isn't there.

I hear it's better wide and better with Free vs .99 BookBubs, but I haven't had good luck getting Free BookBubs in some time. I wouldn't turn down a BookBub, but I wouldn't plan around one either. Just keep submitting different books, on the timelines they allow. Eventually, you'll get one.

Of course, I can only seem to get new adult 'Bubs. I don't know what you have to do to get one in erotic romance. I hear they're better, but I don't expect to get one... ever.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #27 on: February 26, 2021, 08:06:32 AM »
I make the assumption that BookBub is doing all this nagging overmarketing because in fact readers do not click as much anymore. They aren't the only discount newsletter in town.

It could be, however, that readers are clicking but are favoring trad pub backlist titles over indie titles. It would be lovely if someone who was trad pubbed and had a BookBub could provide us with figures or even with a sense of how successful the ads are, but my bet is that they are not privy to the results at all and they may not even know how much or how little the trad pub pays for the ads--which could be on a different tier than the pricing for indies.

An opposite possibility is that BookBub's increasing space given to backlist trad pub books has made its original core readers less interested in their newsletters. Those books are already in the public library and some are available to borrow as ebooks. Do I need to buy a 30-year-old Ellis Peters mystery through BookBub? Probably not. 

Or it simply could be that there is a lot of competition today and readers are choosier. I know as a reader there was a moment years ago when suddenly there were more Regency romances published per month than I could read. I could afford to buy them all (I had a job!), but there were too many to read and I quickly discovered some were inferior. It made me back away from all of them. The same happened with contemporary romances. Too many? Stick with well-known and trusted authors. However, that does not account for diminishing returns for indie authors who have been around for a while, does it?

Maybe someone else has some insights into why the BookBub trend is down.

 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #28 on: February 26, 2021, 08:36:16 AM »
Interesting.

I'd add to the thinking that performance of all paid eshots appear to be declining and that's been true for years. This downward trend isn't just BookBub. BookBub invested heavily in 2014/15 to build up the huge mail list they have today. I suspect they're suffering from the same thing that's taken down the other paid eshot providers, it just wasn't as visible as quickly because their mail lists are so large.

I suspect the same. I think email fatigue is part of it.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #29 on: February 26, 2021, 10:14:00 AM »
I was going to make the same point about the ordering and the email. Some places send you multiple ones a day.

I just talked to my kid (15).  She gets youtube notifications when the (mom's note - idiot) youtubers she like posts a new video. Those pop up on her phone. She also gets notications on her phone when someone emails her - once every two to three weeks. We've got a whole generation of potential readers who don't use email at all or at least avoid it. I think what makes the most sense is (following the youtube model) is having people subscribe to notifications and they will pop up on their phone. For example, someone follows an author they like on Kobo and signs up for notifications. When the author has a new release a notification can pop up on their phone.

Getting off topic, sorry.
 
The following users thanked this post: Seoulite

Anarchist

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2021, 10:54:23 AM »
But I have been trying to understand why BookBub isn't performing anymore. Are they losing subscribers? Is there a general trend against indies or Amazon books or books in general? Are people just fed up with getting emails?

In my opinion, it's an effect of supply and demand.

There are countless books offered for sale or $0.99. Meanwhile, people like myself have limited time to read. So, I glance through the daily BB email. If something catches my eye, I'll click.

I won't download or buy if the book...

  • has fewer than 50 reviews
  • has a review average lower than 4.3
  • is part of a series and not book #1
  • is part of a series that is not complete

I have other criteria, but will keep them to myself lest I offend someone.

The point is, books have to get through a lot of filters to get my download/purchase. I'm sure many other readers follow a similar practice.

When producers create a glut of supply, customers become more discriminating in their choices.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: there is never enough of anything to fully satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics.” – Thomas Sowell

"The State is an institution run by gangs of murderers, plunderers and thieves, surrounded by willing executioners, propagandists, sycophants, crooks, liars, clowns, charlatans, dupes and useful idiots—an institution that dirties and taints everything it touches.” - Hans Hoppe

"Virtue is more to be feared than vice, because its excesses are not subject to the regulation of conscience." - Adam Smith

Nothing that requires the labor of others is a basic human right.

I keep a stiff upper lip and shoot from the hip. - AC/DC
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2021, 12:27:02 PM »
Side note: The largest groups of readers are not young. They're people who have to use email at work or used to before they retired and they use email at home, too. The young who grow up to get decent jobs will find themselves forced to use email because that's a form of documentation that the employer owns and insists on. I think the concern that people won't use email in the future is unwarranted--for now, anyway.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #32 on: February 26, 2021, 02:06:59 PM »
My current intl bookbub is for a wide, 99c title. I had one in December for a KU exclusive 99c title. The wide one, despite this only being day 3, has sold twice as many copies** as the KU exclusive one did. Rank is Amazon, Kobo, Google, Apple, B&N*

*still waiting for B&N figs.

**treating both books as identical commodities here, which is obviously not the case

It's possible a US BB would have a different outcome, but I can only report on whatever figures I have.  Bear in mind I promo-stacked with the same sites both times.

The result of the wide BB does support my decision to leave KU, in my opinion.






 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #33 on: February 26, 2021, 09:47:33 PM »
Well congrats on your latest bookbub Simon.

With the amount of entries bookbub gets I'm surprised they are accepting books with less than a 4.3 review rating.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #34 on: February 27, 2021, 12:24:25 AM »
Mine only has a 3.9, but a lot of the 1* are complaining that it's 'book one in a trilogy'

That died down a lot after I put a graphic on the first or second page explaining what a trilogy was, with the help of some cover thumbnails and big friendly arrows.

Earlier this year I included the first chapter from books 2 & 3 in the previous book, so they could SEE that it continued.
 

Post-Crisis D

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #35 on: February 27, 2021, 02:15:47 AM »
Side note: The largest groups of readers are not young. They're people who have to use email at work or used to before they retired and they use email at home, too. The young who grow up to get decent jobs will find themselves forced to use email because that's a form of documentation that the employer owns and insists on. I think the concern that people won't use email in the future is unwarranted--for now, anyway.

I've been hearing that people don't use eMail anymore for like ten or more years now.  :shrug

When people stop putting eMail addresses on their business cards, then maybe I'll believe it.
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 
The following users thanked this post: Anarchist

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #36 on: February 27, 2021, 03:22:00 AM »
IANAL but I think there are probably good legal reasons to use email in business correspondence.

The question is can some platform (Walmart?) get people who prefer text and like to read get people to sign up for text notifications for deals on books or new releases by favorite authors to be notified on their phone? Will that become the next generation email newsletter promo thingy?

Are any other types of businesses doing this? I wouldn't know. I go to great pains not to give out my cellphone number. Ten years ago, more, my friend put my number in some service that texted me any time she walked into a CVS or Target. I was pissed. Managed to ask nicely to get her to take me off the list. She was getting points for it or something.

Side note - I went poking around Walmart to see if they added a notification when they sent you to Kobo, but instead of finding that I found that one of my titles is wrong. It's bizarre. Picture the cover and description of The Hunger Games with a Title like "Ancient Egyptian Myths and Legends."
 

Anarchist

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #37 on: February 27, 2021, 03:28:07 AM »
Side note: The largest groups of readers are not young. They're people who have to use email at work or used to before they retired and they use email at home, too. The young who grow up to get decent jobs will find themselves forced to use email because that's a form of documentation that the employer owns and insists on. I think the concern that people won't use email in the future is unwarranted--for now, anyway.

I've been hearing that people don't use eMail anymore for like ten or more years now.  :shrug

When people stop putting eMail addresses on their business cards, then maybe I'll believe it.

When people stop joining my lists, emailing me to discuss my books and emails (and share weirdly intimate details about their lives), and clicking my links to buy my stuff, I'll believe it.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: there is never enough of anything to fully satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics.” – Thomas Sowell

"The State is an institution run by gangs of murderers, plunderers and thieves, surrounded by willing executioners, propagandists, sycophants, crooks, liars, clowns, charlatans, dupes and useful idiots—an institution that dirties and taints everything it touches.” - Hans Hoppe

"Virtue is more to be feared than vice, because its excesses are not subject to the regulation of conscience." - Adam Smith

Nothing that requires the labor of others is a basic human right.

I keep a stiff upper lip and shoot from the hip. - AC/DC
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #38 on: February 27, 2021, 03:32:51 AM »
For me it's more about that there are people out there who don't want to use email and we are not reaching them. It doesn't mean we have to give up on using email, it means there is a potential untapped audience.
 

Post-Crisis D

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #39 on: February 27, 2021, 03:39:23 AM »
The question is can some platform (Walmart?) get people who prefer text and like to read get people to sign up for text notifications for deals on books or new releases by favorite authors to be notified on their phone? Will that become the next generation email newsletter promo thingy?

Are any other types of businesses doing this? I wouldn't know. I go to great pains not to give out my cellphone number. Ten years ago, more, my friend put my number in some service that texted me any time she walked into a CVS or Target. I was pissed. Managed to ask nicely to get her to take me off the list. She was getting points for it or something.

I think that would be a problem too.  I mean, there is more or less a finite number of phone numbers.  That is, you can't just make one up.  And, if you change numbers, odds are you'll get a number someone else used previously and end up getting a lot of junk calls directed at them.  For example, at the office, we switched phone providers a number of years ago and what they did was map our numbers to new numbers so we could keep our numbers.  But, those numbers our numbers mapped/forwarded to were numbers previously used by someone else.  So, for years, there were collection calls for people that never worked here and it seems no matter what you do you cannot get those collection agencies to stop calling.  And then the debt gets sold and different collection agencies start calling.  Those calls stopped when we switched phone providers again a year or so ago.  Finally.

With eMail, on the other hand, the potential combinations are infinite.  So, if you start getting too much junk eMail at one address, you can change your eMail to something else.  Now, with phone numbers, since there is a finite number of them, junk callers can guess your number.  With eMail, spammers use dictionary attacks where they will use common words and proper names to guess at eMail addresses.  If you avoid such combinations, and use something like author2371@whatever.dom, it's darned near impossible for them to guess it and they would likely only obtain it if you used it somewhere that was hacked or sold or if they scraped it from a site you'd posted on using it.

Bottom line is that it's easier to filter junk and spam from eMail than from phone numbers.

Maybe one day, someone will create the best of both worlds, like an eMail address that can be used for eMail, texting and phone calls, similar to how a phone number can be used for texts and calls.
Mulder: "If you're distracted by fear of those around you, it keeps you from seeing the actions of those above."
The X-Files: "Blood"
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #40 on: February 27, 2021, 03:53:07 AM »
Oh boy do I know that. Someone named Abigal had my phone number before me and I still get a couple of spam texts a month for her. In the beginning it was relentless.

Legitimate businesses do ask for your cell phone (eg doctor's offices to text appointment reminders). Whether people want more stuff on their phone is a personal choice. You make a lot of good points, Dan.

But as paid, third party, email promo newsletters become less effective I do wonder what the next big thing will be.

 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #41 on: February 27, 2021, 03:23:26 PM »
I don't write for young people. They can just grow up and learn to use email.

 grint

Seriously, chasing a market that is anti words in actual punctuated sentences does not strike me as a good way to sell my books. Which, you know, have lots of words in actual punctuated sentences.

 Grin
 
The following users thanked this post: Post-Crisis D

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #42 on: February 27, 2021, 11:07:54 PM »
Well with the decline of the third party, paid, email promo and not being able to get the ball rolling on AMS to save my life, I'd really like some other options. Still working on my personal mailing list (2 new subscribers this week).  I'll dip back into google ads eventually.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #43 on: February 27, 2021, 11:12:40 PM »
Well with the decline of the third party, paid, email promo and not being able to get the ball rolling on AMS to save my life, I'd really like some other options. Still working on my personal mailing list (2 new subscribers this week).  I'll dip back into google ads eventually.
I've had more success with Facebook ads than anything else.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #44 on: February 27, 2021, 11:22:46 PM »
Thanks. I am of the "no way I'm getting sucked into Facebook" tribe, at my own peril, I realize.

Also, I do know kids/teens/young adults who are big readers. Just not my kids. :( But they don't use email unless forced too.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #45 on: February 27, 2021, 11:35:21 PM »
Thanks, I'm actually wide too. Right now I'm doing a light edit on my first trilogy and adding my website and mailing list to the end of it. I have to do that to most of my books. Once that's done I'll do a bknights on it. Cheap and usually good for a couple of hundred downloads. I'll see if that gets me any mailing list subscribers.

Tackling google ads again is definitely on my list and I may try to do it for my April release.

Side complaint - got a one page page read this month. I realize someone could have had the book since I left KU completely (2018) but there is at least a chance they could have read it in page flip and I get nothing so I'm steaming over that again.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #46 on: February 27, 2021, 11:58:01 PM »
First in trilogy permafree was a dependable 200-300 downloads for bknights for me. I think they do well for romance, which the trilogy is. I used to start my stacked promos with that one when I was in KU and do 5 days of promos a quarter to get it pushed up in the ranks. Then books two and three would sell and those would stay in the top 100 paid ranks and keep the tail going once the first book reverted back to paid.

I tried a couple of 99 cent ones with bknights and it wasn't good, they actually contacted me to refund my money they felt so bad about it.

I like working with the Written Word people, but free and bargain booksy have gotten more expensive and diminishing returns.

So we'll see how it goes, I should be running the bknights sometime in March, if I can stay motivated on the edit, almost done with book 2.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #47 on: February 28, 2021, 12:09:50 AM »
Thanks. I am of the "no way I'm getting sucked into Facebook" tribe, at my own peril, I realize.

Also, I do know kids/teens/young adults who are big readers. Just not my kids. :( But they don't use email unless forced too.
Okay, your choice. I'm running a free Booksy and Booksends for a free first in series this week, so I'll let you know. I'm still waiting to hear from EReader News Today.
 
The following users thanked this post: notthatamanda

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #48 on: February 28, 2021, 12:24:13 AM »
Hope it goes well!
Thanks. So do I. I've never done a promotion like this before. I've always done Facebook ads, but I'm saving my money till I get paid from Amazon at the end of March. I know a really successful writer who uses these sorts of promotions all the time, so let's hope. I don't know how long ENT will take to get back to me.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #49 on: February 28, 2021, 12:36:51 AM »
If I remember correctly, ENT might not notify you if you don't get accepted. Not 100% sure. Good luck and thanks for offering to share the results.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #50 on: February 28, 2021, 12:50:47 AM »
If I remember correctly, ENT might not notify you if you don't get accepted. Not 100% sure. Good luck and thanks for offering to share the results.
Well, I'm not holding my breath. They'll want paying if they do run it!
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #51 on: February 28, 2021, 01:24:28 AM »
If I remember correctly, ENT might not notify you if you don't get accepted. Not 100% sure. Good luck and thanks for offering to share the results.
True dat. The last time I inquired after hearing nothing about my submission for two weeks, I got a snippy, unprofessional reply. I crossed ENT off my list for good that day.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #52 on: February 28, 2021, 01:49:48 AM »
If I remember correctly, ENT might not notify you if you don't get accepted. Not 100% sure. Good luck and thanks for offering to share the results.
True dat. The last time I inquired after hearing nothing about my submission for two weeks, I got a snippy, unprofessional reply. I crossed ENT off my list for good that day.
Well, I've never tried them before so I'll wait and see. I still have the other two.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #53 on: March 05, 2021, 05:32:08 PM »
If I remember correctly, ENT might not notify you if you don't get accepted. Not 100% sure. Good luck and thanks for offering to share the results.
As promised, I ran the first of my six book time slip series yesterday. I used Freebooksy, Booksends and EReader News Today.

I had 2,500 free downloads, 8,300 page reads and 76 sales, most of which were the rest of the series. Of the page reads, over 2,000 were for a historical six book series that I had advertised before. Also, those page reads are the amount I usually get in a day, but they might pick up later on. So, I am very pleased with those results. I am thinking there are probably people who haven't yet read their newsletters from the providers, so fingers crossed today will be good as well.

Just as an aside, I haven't tried any promotion sites before, except an obscure one who picked up my book when they got started. I don't think they caught on because they don't seem to appear anywhere anymore.
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #54 on: March 05, 2021, 09:42:13 PM »
Congratulations on the results and thanks for sharing them.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #55 on: March 05, 2021, 09:51:43 PM »
Congratulations on the results and thanks for sharing them.
No problem. Now let's see how it keeps up!
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #56 on: March 05, 2021, 11:02:55 PM »
What did you get for ranks, if you don't mind sharing. Hopefully the sales on books 2 and on will get you some nice ranks there, so even if the first book reverts back to paid that will help keep the visibility.
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #57 on: March 05, 2021, 11:20:12 PM »
What did you get for ranks, if you don't mind sharing. Hopefully the sales on books 2 and on will get you some nice ranks there, so even if the first book reverts back to paid that will help keep the visibility.

I never look at ranks, but I'll have a peek.

Book 2 is 16,500 in the whole US store, 69 in time Travel Fiction. Book 3 is 20,000 or so in the whole store and 148 in Occult Horror for some unknown reason.

Book one, which was the promotion, is number 52 in the whole store free No.1 in Historical mystery and thriller and No. 1 in occult horror.

I didn't put the book in those categories at all. They were all in sci-fi time travel fiction.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #58 on: March 06, 2021, 12:49:34 AM »
Side note - you can email author central and give them the book categories you want to be in, if that interests you.

The ranks are interesting. I can't remember exactly the data from when the free lists were clogged with botted books but I think that now even though paid, email newsletter promos are down, you still get the same ranks you would have with 5-10 times more downloads back then.

Thanks for sharing the data.
 
The following users thanked this post: Doglover

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #59 on: March 06, 2021, 02:31:32 AM »
Congrats and thanks for sharing your results!
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #60 on: March 06, 2021, 09:52:52 PM »
I forgot to say, I had 2,500 downloads on day one and another 1,500 or so the following day.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #61 on: March 16, 2021, 07:28:15 AM »
I just submitted another title to BookBub for a featured deal and as I was making a note of it and the date, I automatically filled in "Rejected."

I really should wait a few hours.  Grin
 
The following users thanked this post: Jackie

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #62 on: March 16, 2021, 11:44:17 PM »
I just submitted again. Added some extra insurance to ensure my rejection by saying US only. I haven't heard back from KDP why my perma free books in the non US stores aren't permafree.

Lily - virtual flowers to whoever gets their rejection first?
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #63 on: March 17, 2021, 11:15:23 PM »
I've set a reminder to apply towards the end of this month (fantasy category, worldwide). I've never submitting this one before.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #64 on: March 17, 2021, 11:35:12 PM »
Good luck.
 

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #65 on: March 18, 2021, 08:40:28 AM »
It took them two and a half days....REJECTED.

I hadn't applied for a while but wide wasn't the difference.  Maybe it's being permafree?  I have no idea.

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 


Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #67 on: March 18, 2021, 09:46:13 AM »
Thank you, Amanda!


Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #68 on: March 18, 2021, 02:44:48 PM »
I got an international BookBub!

I totally did not expect this. Just this week, a review vanished from the book's Amazon page, and I was sure that would be the coup de grace and remove all hope.

It's for April 15, always a lucky day for me.

Now I'll have to scurry around and stack some additional promos.

Still can't believe it. 
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #69 on: March 18, 2021, 05:30:56 PM »
I got an international BookBub!

I totally did not expect this. Just this week, a review vanished from the book's Amazon page, and I was sure that would be the coup de grace and remove all hope.

It's for April 15, always a lucky day for me.

Now I'll have to scurry around and stack some additional promos.

Still can't believe it.
Can you answer a question, please, Lily?

Why do people always seem to stack a lot of other promotions to go with a Bookbub? If Bookbub is so great, why do you need any others? And if you've got all those others, how do you know that Bookbub is so great?

And congratulations :tup3b
 

Gerri Attrick

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #70 on: March 18, 2021, 06:16:01 PM »
Yay, congrats, Lily. Here's hoping it's a good one. Let us know how it goes.  :banana-riding-llama-smiley-em
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #71 on: March 18, 2021, 08:42:54 PM »
I got an international BookBub!
Awesomeness!  :dance:
Good luck!
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #72 on: March 18, 2021, 08:49:11 PM »
I got an international BookBub!

I totally did not expect this. Just this week, a review vanished from the book's Amazon page, and I was sure that would be the coup de grace and remove all hope.

It's for April 15, always a lucky day for me.

Now I'll have to scurry around and stack some additional promos.

Still can't believe it.
:clap:
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #73 on: March 18, 2021, 10:59:39 PM »
Promo stacks really got going a few years ago when Wayne Stinnett showed how his rankings and thus his sales improved if in essence he made a big splash. He even took notice of the time of day each discount newsletter went out, so he stacked his ads to capitalize on the timing.

However, since then, Amazon has done some unpleasant things to books whose sales spike dramatically. Amazon has squashed those spikes in various ways. So now the wisdom (for domestic BookBubs or for any launch plan) is to improve ranking more gradually, leading up to the BookBub spike and possibly trailing after it, too.

That said, I don't know how a domestic ad will help an international BookBub, so any advice others have to offer is welcome. 
 
The following users thanked this post: Doglover

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #74 on: March 18, 2021, 11:32:16 PM »
Not sure this counts as advice.

Intl bookbub #1 - I also reduced the price in the US. 99 cents. I got a lot of downloads. A week later I started raising the price gradually and turned on more ads/added more ads (AMS) when the price got high enough to justify them. The higher rank when I started the ads back up got me instant relevance and great placement with low CPC. Kept the ads running and the book selling well at full price for 9-10 months.

Enter Intl bookbub #2 - turned off ads and reduced price in the US. Did not get a lot of downloads. Was never able to get the AMS momentum going again.

The first Intl bookbub was extremely profitable because of the US sales, even though the bookbub was *not* in the US. The second one I didn't even make back the $200ish bucks it cost me.

So like I said, not advice, other than if US sales are going well, don't mess with it.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2021, 11:34:22 PM by notthatamanda »
 
The following users thanked this post: R. C., LilyBLily

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #75 on: March 19, 2021, 01:46:47 AM »
I do the same for intl bookbubs - reduce the price in the US, and then book promos leading up to the BB (most of these are US focused anyway.)

I think I read somewhere that Amazon won't let you price a book at 99c in one country and 4 times as much in another, but I might be mis-remembering.


 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #76 on: March 19, 2021, 02:47:44 AM »
I do the same for intl bookbubs - reduce the price in the US, and then book promos leading up to the BB (most of these are US focused anyway.)

I think I read somewhere that Amazon won't let you price a book at 99c in one country and 4 times as much in another, but I might be mis-remembering.
That's only if you're doing a countdown deal. It has to stay the same price everywhere for a certain amount of time before and after. Other than that, you can price it all different prices wherever you like.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #77 on: March 19, 2021, 03:13:15 AM »
Last time I ran an intl BB I stacked US promos at the same time too. I think it helped. The other time to stack is for bestseller status, so I've heard. Otherwise, you'll get plenty of sales just doing a Bookbub alone.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #78 on: March 19, 2021, 05:09:10 AM »
Rejected. 2 days 3 hours.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #79 on: March 19, 2021, 05:37:43 AM »
This week, me too :icon_sad:
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #80 on: March 19, 2021, 07:45:46 AM »
This week, me too :icon_sad:
Why isn't it Friday yet? :cheers
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #81 on: March 19, 2021, 08:00:25 AM »
I'm waiting for rejection #60 since my last acceptance...
 

Jeff Tanyard

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #82 on: March 19, 2021, 10:31:59 AM »
Congrats, Lily.   :cheers
v  v  v  v  v    Short Stories    v  v  v  v  v    vv FREE! vv
     
Genres: Science Fiction, Fantasy (some day) | Author Website
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #83 on: March 19, 2021, 12:17:01 PM »
Thanks, all.

Now I have to figure out how I'm supposed to lower the price internationally without lowering the price in the U.S. Or do most of you lower the price across the board in every country and in the U.S.? Of course I understand doing it on Amazon, but what about B&N et al.? Is there a thread discussing how long it takes them to respond and which venues allow one to arrange the sale price in advance?

 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #84 on: March 19, 2021, 01:24:01 PM »
I lower it across the board, because otherwise I'd have to send out a '99 sale but not for you' email to my ML subscribers. Hate doing those (e.g. countdown deals for US and UK only.)
 

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #85 on: March 19, 2021, 05:07:57 PM »
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #86 on: April 13, 2021, 10:03:57 PM »
In anticipation of my international BookBub, I decided to update the frontmatter and backmatter of some other books. Not the one being featured.

Amazon accepted the files and okayed them. D2D said the epubs had errors and issued me dire warnings, so I spent some hours in the weeds with the html tags and got them all pretty for D2D. The issues were some closing tags only. To my eye, the pages still looked fine. Should I replace the files on Amazon with these even newer files?

What about any other stores? Are they so slow to update that it would be a mistake? This is very last minute and I'm not sure that updated frontmatter and backmatter are crucial for sell through of other titles.

(And yes, I should have thought about this weeks ago.)
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #87 on: April 13, 2021, 10:30:12 PM »
What did you have to change? Are your links working?
 

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #88 on: April 13, 2021, 10:52:42 PM »
LilyBLily, congrats on the international Bookbub - do let us know how it goes for you.

In the spirit of this thread, I hope it's ok to share that I've also got an international Bookbub coming up on Sunday, 18 April. This was a bit of a shock, as all my books are in KU. The International Bookbub is for a box set of the complete (five book) first series which is normally 8.99 USD / GBP, but which I've reduced to 0.99 USD / GBP for April.

I've applied the reduction worldwide as it was an experiment - I've applied for a Bookbub on this box set before now, but always been rejected, so it was a nice surprise to get the international deal.

Side note: I've also run promos with Fussy Librarian, Bargainbooksy and ENT for the 0.99 box set this month and the results, well, dismal just about covers it - I don't think I've covered my costs even for Fussy Librarian. So I don't have high hopes for Bookbub, but I was delighted to get the slot anyway.

     



Genre: Fantasy
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #89 on: April 13, 2021, 11:41:29 PM »
No links involved in the tag issue. Got my fingers crossed.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #90 on: April 13, 2021, 11:47:06 PM »
Personally I wouldn't mess with files at this point then. Good luck to both of you Lily and Vanessa. <fingers crossed emoji>
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily, VanessaC

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #91 on: April 14, 2021, 03:06:44 AM »
My newsletter and the first paid ad have hit this morning with 22 sales so far. Nine clicks from my newsletter--and one unsubscribe and one spam complaint! It takes all kinds, right?

Good luck, VanessaC. Your box set should do well. Mine is stand-alone women's fiction and 99 cents for something that's usually $6.99. If that's not enough of a bargain, they can kiss my patootie.

Including the BookBub ad at $204, I've paid $60 for additional ads spaced out this week. Not a lot, but enough of a risk when I really don't know if the BookBub ad itself will do much. I might do a Facebook ad for the book this weekend, too, although FB ads make me queasy.
 
The following users thanked this post: VanessaC

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #92 on: April 14, 2021, 09:32:28 AM »
Now up to 46 sales, and 30 clicks from my newsletter. A few more unsubscribes, too.

Edited to add: Ended the day with 52 sales and 32 clicks from my newsletter.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2021, 02:11:52 PM by LilyBLily »
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #93 on: April 14, 2021, 01:17:12 PM »
Now up to 46 sales, and 30 clicks from my newsletter. A few more unsubscribes, too.
:Tup2: Keep the sales coming. Good luck Lily & Vanessa!
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily, VanessaC

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #94 on: April 14, 2021, 07:12:36 PM »
I have an international-only bookbub on the 16th April (A Riddle in Bronze, which is a gaslamp fantasy in the Paranormal Suspense BB category).

I've never run a promotion for this or reduced the price before so I'm interested to see how it goes.

I've also reduced the US price to 99c and booked nine promos of various kinds for that market. I think the first of those kicks off tonight.


 
The following users thanked this post: VanessaC

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #95 on: April 14, 2021, 11:31:02 PM »
Good luck on yours!

I have another promo today, and then I pause for BookBub tomorrow and have one more the day after. I had planned to do more, but then decided to wait and see. I can always tack on a Facebook ad without significant prior arrangements. I've already created the visual for one following David Gaughran's advice, so it wouldn't be hugely time-consuming to put it in place. I hope. FB is so labyrinthine.

Anyway, watching the numbers is entertainment. I just have to remind myself that I am paying for this entertainment.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #96 on: April 14, 2021, 11:32:55 PM »
Good luck to both of you!
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #97 on: April 15, 2021, 10:05:10 PM »
At 8 AM EDT: I'm surprised that my BookBub ad has not hit in the UK yet. Either that or there are zero sales in the UK. Those of you who know BookBub's timing are free to snicker at my excitement.

Day 1    54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2    10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3    ? sales BookBub

Updates to come!
« Last Edit: April 15, 2021, 10:37:46 PM by LilyBLily »
 
The following users thanked this post: VanessaC

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #98 on: April 15, 2021, 11:53:36 PM »
Fingers crossed for you.
 

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #99 on: April 16, 2021, 12:23:41 AM »
At 8 AM EDT: I'm surprised that my BookBub ad has not hit in the UK yet. Either that or there are zero sales in the UK. Those of you who know BookBub's timing are free to snicker at my excitement.

Day 1    54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2    10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3    ? sales BookBub

Updates to come!

I'm in the UK and signed up to Bookbub as a reader. My Bookbub emails usually come in between 2pm and 3pm UK-time, and your post was showing at 1pm UK-time, so I'd say that the Bookbub email hadn't been sent out in the UK at that point.

Am sure those sales will start rolling in soon - good luck!

Edited to add: as I post this it's about 3.20pm in the UK, and my Bookbub email came through just before 3pm.
     



Genre: Fantasy
 

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #100 on: April 16, 2021, 12:24:03 AM »
I have an international-only bookbub on the 16th April (A Riddle in Bronze, which is a gaslamp fantasy in the Paranormal Suspense BB category).

I've never run a promotion for this or reduced the price before so I'm interested to see how it goes.

I've also reduced the US price to 99c and booked nine promos of various kinds for that market. I think the first of those kicks off tonight.

Good luck for your interenational bookbub!
     



Genre: Fantasy
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #101 on: April 16, 2021, 04:32:03 AM »
Day 1    54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2    10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3    12 sales from B&N
            52 sales from Kobo
            204 sales from Amazon--which seems a apt number since $204 was the price of the ad.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 04:34:34 AM by LilyBLily »
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #102 on: April 16, 2021, 05:42:25 AM »
Congratulations.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #103 on: April 16, 2021, 07:33:33 AM »
Day 1    54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2    10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3    12 sales from B&N--remarkable, considering B&N doesn't do international anymore.
            58 sales from Kobo
              0 sales from Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)
          238 sales from Amazon
Total so far: 372 sales, or nearly half of what is needed to break even.

BookBub kindly sent me at my request a screen shot of the ad--with the copy they wrote to promote it. That sales copy is probably worth all that I have spent so far. You can bet I'm going to copy it word for word when I apply for a U.S. BookBub for this title.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #104 on: April 16, 2021, 07:43:34 AM »
If you are talking about the bookbub blurb, you can see it on your bookbub page, or at least you used to be able to. I only ever had an Intl bookbub and I took note of it. I was similarly impressed with the one they did for me.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #105 on: April 16, 2021, 11:14:27 AM »
Day 1   April 13   54 sales Amazon, 12 sales B&N. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a more than respectable 34 sales from FKBT ad. (Repositioned the B&N sales as they all occurred on Apr 13.)
Day 2   April 14   10 sales Amazon from Book Doggy ad. I don't call that a success.
Day 3   April 15   All sales from international BookBub ad
                         71 sales Kobo
                         257 sales Amazon
                           0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Total as of 9 PM EDT: 404 sales, or more than half of what is needed to break even.

I'd be happy to reach 425 by end of day, but that may not happen. I myself don't usually open my daily BB newsletter the day it arrives, so I do assume a tail. So far, no sell through to other titles, but this sale is for a stand-alone title, not a series starter.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #106 on: April 16, 2021, 02:11:28 PM »
Day 1   April 13   54 sales Amazon      Ad on FKBT, and my newsletter
                         12 sales B&N
Day 2   April 14   10 sales Amazon      Ad on Book Doggy
Day 3   April 15                                 Ad on International BookBub
                         71 sales Kobo
                         263 sales Amazon
                           0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Day 4   April 16  At 12 AM EDT, both Amazon and Kobo have rolled over to the next day despite Amazon usually using Pacific time.
                        84 sales Amazon
                         6 sales Kobo

Total so far: 500 sales   

To come later on April 16, ad on eReaderIQ
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 02:19:15 PM by LilyBLily »
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes, VanessaC

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #107 on: April 16, 2021, 08:23:10 PM »
 :clap:
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #108 on: April 16, 2021, 10:23:45 PM »
Day 1   April 13   54 sales Amazon     Ad on FKBT, plus my newsletter
                         12 sales B&N
Day 2   April 14  10 sales Amazon      Ad on Book Doggy
Day 3   April 15                                Ad on International BookBub
                         71 sales Kobo
                       263 sales Amazon
                           0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Day 4   April 16 At 8 AM EDT
                       108 sales Amazon
                         10 sales Kobo

Total so far: 528 sales   

To come later today, ad on eReaderIQ

By my calculations the breakeven is 776 sales, depending on currency fluctuations.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #109 on: April 17, 2021, 12:28:38 AM »
More revisions as lag reporting plays a role:

Day 1   April 13   54 sales Amazon     Ad on FKBT, plus my newsletter
                         12 sales B&N
Day 2   April 14  10 sales Amazon      Ad on Book Doggy--maybe not a loser after all?
                        15 sales B&N
Day 3   April 15                                Ad on International BookBub
                         71 sales Kobo
                       263 sales Amazon
                         67 sales reported by Draft2Digital for Apple
                          ? sales to come B&N reported Saturday or Monday?
Day 4   April 16 At 10 AM EDT
                       111 sales Amazon
                         12 sales Kobo

Total so far: 615 sales   

To come later today, ad on eReaderIQ--I'm not subscribed, so I'm not sure if it has dropped yet.

By my calculations the breakeven is 776 sales, depending on currency fluctuations.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #110 on: April 17, 2021, 10:27:03 PM »
Didn't want to bore anyone with the slower stats yesterday, much as they interested me. Google Play did finally report a handful of sales, and B&N did report this morning even though it's a weekend, as did D2D for Apple sales. The promotion is officially in positive dollars as of 8 AM EDT. I had miscalculated the royalty amounts granted in the non-Amazon stores, but even so, the totals already exceed my initial breakeven number of 776.

Bookbub's average sales for this category: 760

My book's sales so far:

502 Amazon
125 Apple
95 Kobo
56 B&N
13 Google Play

Total: 791

So, technically, this promo is a success.


Woo-hoo!
 

Maggie Ann

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #111 on: April 17, 2021, 11:17:35 PM »
 :banana-riding-llama-smiley-em
           
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #112 on: April 18, 2021, 01:35:48 AM »
Yay! Maybe you picked up some new fans too.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #113 on: April 18, 2021, 04:02:39 AM »
My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.
 
The following users thanked this post: VanessaC

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #114 on: April 18, 2021, 06:42:22 AM »
Congratulations!
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #115 on: April 18, 2021, 07:55:57 AM »
My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.

That's good news.  :clap:
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

Maggie Ann

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #116 on: April 18, 2021, 09:02:24 AM »
My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.

 :banana:
           
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

Jeff Tanyard

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #117 on: April 18, 2021, 10:17:53 AM »
Congrats, Lily and Simon!   :cheers
v  v  v  v  v    Short Stories    v  v  v  v  v    vv FREE! vv
     
Genres: Science Fiction, Fantasy (some day) | Author Website
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #118 on: April 18, 2021, 08:30:41 PM »
540 now.  Another 210 in the US from the other stacked promos (with a couple more to come).  The stacked promos cost me $175 US and the BB was $120 from memory.

I only have 1st day figures for Apple and Google, as they always lag a bit. Kobo performed well as usual, with most of the sales in Canada.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #119 on: April 18, 2021, 10:52:27 PM »
Great! Happy for you.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #120 on: April 18, 2021, 10:58:19 PM »
That's excellent. You're really chugging past the expected number.
 :banana-riding-llama-smiley-em
 
 

JackT

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #121 on: April 18, 2021, 11:37:27 PM »
Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months. :)
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #122 on: April 18, 2021, 11:53:14 PM »
Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months. :)

I know that's the received wisdom, but we've already advertised our books on U.S. newsletters, and surely BookBub can only count clicks from its ads and check our rankings on certain days?

So if, say, the direct clicks from the BookBub ad for my book only equaled or neared their average--even though the clicks from other newsletters produced many more sales and created a profit--why would BookBub think our books were good candidates for what would be in essence a repeat sale in the U.S.?

Seriously wondering. What has been other people's recent experience?   
 

JackT

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #123 on: April 19, 2021, 12:03:05 AM »
I had an international Bookbub in February for a later-in-series book. It did reasonably well - getting the average number of sales Bookbub suggested - and I've just secured a US deal for next month (yay!).

I had another international earlier this month, on a standalone book, which did slightly less well. It will be interesting to see if that one gets a deal in July/August.

Both books were available in the US, at 0.99, but I didn't do anything to promote them there.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #124 on: April 19, 2021, 12:43:37 AM »
Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months. :)

I know that's the received wisdom, but we've already advertised our books on U.S. newsletters, and surely BookBub can only count clicks from its ads and check our rankings on certain days?

So if, say, the direct clicks from the BookBub ad for my book only equaled or neared their average--even though the clicks from other newsletters produced many more sales and created a profit--why would BookBub think our books were good candidates for what would be in essence a repeat sale in the U.S.?

Seriously wondering. What has been other people's recent experience?
Not recent, but I had a very good Int'l bookbub Dec 2018 and they never accepted me for a US one.
 

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #125 on: April 19, 2021, 08:10:35 PM »
Congratulations to LilyBLily and Simon Haynes for what sound like successful international bookbubs.

 :banana:   :dance:   :banana:


My own international bookbub ran yesterday - 18 April. This was a 5 book complete series box-set, normally 8.99 and reduced to 0.99 for April.

18 April - 453 sales
19 April (so far) - 177 sales

So a total of 630 sales to date, which I'm delighted with (per Bookbub's own stats, I think the average for fantasy is 460 or thereabouts). Depending on exchange rates, I should also be in profit, which is an unexpected bonus.

The box set also broke into the top 100 paid on Amazon UK, which is another nice bonus, and is sitting high in some of its sub-categories (side note: I might need to look at the categories again, as the UK ones don't look quite right).

A lovely start to the week. Hope everyone else is having a good day.
     



Genre: Fantasy
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #126 on: April 19, 2021, 09:09:48 PM »
Great results Vanessa! Congratulations. I think I'll go apply again.
 
The following users thanked this post: VanessaC

Doglover

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #127 on: April 19, 2021, 09:22:40 PM »
I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #128 on: April 19, 2021, 11:36:02 PM »
I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.

It brought some excitement into my humdrum lockdown life.

You have many titles to choose from. Many of the books featured on BB are not first in series, which runs contrary to the received wisdom about only advertising the first book. My book had only nine reviews, again contrary to the intimidating "thousands of 5-star reviews on Goodreads" that BB often touts. You might as well just pick one and go for it. As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #129 on: April 20, 2021, 06:57:38 AM »
I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.
Your best bet is the first book in your series that has the best read through. Not to imply that is your best bet to get accepted, but that's probably your best bet to make money.
 

TimothyEllis

  • Forum Owner
  • Administrator
  • Series unlocked
  • ******
  • Posts: 5638
  • Thanked: 2203 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Earth Galaxy core, 2618
    • The Hunter Imperium Universe
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #130 on: April 20, 2021, 11:58:00 AM »
As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

That only follows if someone's home market is their primary market, or at least is significant.

When the US is 70-80% of your income, international BB's make no sense.
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



Timothy Ellis Kindle Author page. | Join the Hunter Legacy mailing list | The Hunter Imperium Universe on Facebook. | Forum Promo Page.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #131 on: April 20, 2021, 02:00:13 PM »
As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

That only follows if someone's home market is their primary market, or at least is significant.

When the US is 70-80% of your income, international BB's make no sense.

As long as an ad pays for itself, surely it does make sense--unless you think that the typical support method of stacking US newsletter ads destroys prospects for a successful US BookBub ad. I won't know about that unless I actually get a US BB ad, and that is hardly a given.


 

TimothyEllis

  • Forum Owner
  • Administrator
  • Series unlocked
  • ******
  • Posts: 5638
  • Thanked: 2203 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Earth Galaxy core, 2618
    • The Hunter Imperium Universe
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #132 on: April 20, 2021, 02:14:16 PM »
As long as an ad pays for itself, surely it does make sense

I guess I look at ads differently.

To my way of thinking, if an ad fails to produce a decent profit, then that ad was a failure.

I've had just 1 Intl BB on a book 7. Everyone told me it did well, but I've always viewed it as a total failure, and I'll never do another one.

Ads breaking even is not a rationale for doing them imo.

Sorry, that's just the way I think.
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



Timothy Ellis Kindle Author page. | Join the Hunter Legacy mailing list | The Hunter Imperium Universe on Facebook. | Forum Promo Page.
 
The following users thanked this post: KSenniaV

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #133 on: April 20, 2021, 10:58:37 PM »
For several years, I was very satisfied with the return on my continuous Amazon ads. Then they tanked. Click price has doubled or tripled, which means zero direct profit on the ads. As I've discussed elsewhere, an algorithm change has resulted in search terms Amazon sends to my ad suddenly being terms I've specifically listed as negative that shouldn't be sent at all. Lots of expensive and useless clicks resulting in no sales.

Please do not claim that my Amazon ads still would be successful if only I came up with amazing keywords that no one else has discovered yet romance fans are ravenously responsive to. Romance is an intensely crowded field and I defy anyone to prove that there are any such keywords.

So this year my strategy has changed, and my tactic is to use one-day newsletter ads and see where that gets me. Go look for a new audience. This seems reasonable to me as a beginning step. So far it has been moderately successful in generating reads for my books in KU. This international BookBub may work a similar magic with my wide women's fiction. Or it may not, but at least it hasn't cratered my ad budget.




 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #134 on: April 20, 2021, 11:28:41 PM »
Yeah, I agree. I spent a month of evenings with a trial of a keyword software package trying to find the magic combination of searched a lot but not expensive. Couldn't do it and returned the software.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #135 on: April 21, 2021, 01:34:45 AM »
I haven't used Amazon ads since 2016/17. Too expensive, over complicated, and I'm wide, so I prefer ads that promote multiple platforms.

I don't use newsletters. My various mail lists don't do a lot for me. I think it might be my reader demographic. They don't respond much to newsletters, if at all really.

I need advertising tactics that aren't too expensive, run 24/7, preferably promote all platforms, don't take up much of my time to manage, simple to set up and use, are in my control to run as often and whenever I want, and keep my sales churning with a profit margin.

As for keywords, in my personal opinion people can end up wasting a huge amount of time and money fiddling with keywords for marginal gain.

Late 2016 is when huge numbers of us jumped into the Amazon ads pool and drove the click prices up. I felt it was necessary since at the beginning of 2016 I could release a book and it would immediately sell with no ads. By late 2016, none of my books were were selling, and my new books didn't cause a ripple. So I dove into AMS ads and got an immediate boost in sales that continued for several years. Now, meh. Hence a new strategy.

Keywords that seem completely logical for what a book is can signal to Amazon that it's a different kind of book entirely. I released a Gothic romance that is not a "dark" "Mafia" "biker" "street" romance. That's where Amazon wants to advertise it. Much easier to accurately hype the book in a newsletter ad.

I agree that some newsletters are unresponsive depending on the genre and unfortunately my own personal newsletter is more a tax write-off than a powerful engine to get sales.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #136 on: April 21, 2021, 02:19:27 AM »
I hope Lily doesn't mind me posting this here but add another Bookbub rejection to my total.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #137 on: April 21, 2021, 04:24:26 AM »
This can be our misery thread. No problem about posting another BB rejection.
 Grin
« Last Edit: April 21, 2021, 04:39:55 AM by LilyBLily »
 

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #138 on: April 21, 2021, 12:31:18 PM »
Sorry Amanda. :(

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #139 on: April 21, 2021, 07:56:41 PM »
I hope Lily doesn't mind me posting this here but add another Bookbub rejection to my total.

Sorry to hear that. Even if you're half-expecting it, it's still disappointing.
     



Genre: Fantasy
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #140 on: April 21, 2021, 09:12:18 PM »
Thanks guys, no worries. I'm all about the next big thing and that would be Radish. ;)
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #141 on: April 23, 2021, 07:12:33 AM »
A week after the international BookBub, sales are still dripping in, including more today from B&N (reporting sales of two days ago) than the day before. So it's not a perfect slide to nothing, and meanwhile a couple of full price sales have happened. All the venues have now reverted to the regular price, although I did have to change Google Play manually despite the sale price end date having expired. I'll revert Amazon's price late tonight. 

BookBub has asked for feedback. With over 1k sales and a few more to go, this ad was not life-changing (does that happen anymore?) but the numbers are comfortably above BB's average. That gives me hope that maybe a domestic featured ad might be possible in a few months. BB meanwhile is pushing me to buy PPC ads. I think I'd like to see the profits for this ad run first.
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #142 on: April 23, 2021, 08:28:34 AM »
I'm just setting up for the international BookBub and I noticed if I set the book to 99c on the international sites, Amazon change the royalty to 30% even for the full price book on the US site.

Is this new?
Nope. Always been like that. You either meet the minimum threshold for 70% in all Zon stores, or you get 35% everywhere.
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #143 on: April 23, 2021, 08:46:44 AM »
I'm just setting up for the international BookBub and I noticed if I set the book to 99c on the international sites, Amazon change the royalty to 30% even for the full price book on the US site.

Is this new?
Nope. Always been like that. You either meet the minimum threshold for 70% in all Zon stores, or you get 35% everywhere.

Thanks. I don't usually only discount international only and, the few times I have, I never noticed that.

Sucks.  :icon_sad:

Of course, you can play the price match game by dropping it to 99c a few days ahead of time on other retailers... When the Zon price-matches, it doesn't change the payout percentage... Risky? Sure. Just sayin'  :cool:
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #144 on: April 23, 2021, 10:59:06 AM »
So if I try to raise the price on Amazon tonight, it won't do anything for three days?  :icon_think:

I guess I don't mind all that much because sales are still coming in on Amazon, presumably from people finally opening their sales newsletters.
 
 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #145 on: April 23, 2021, 08:46:25 PM »
To add another data point to this thread: I just got accepted for an all-areas free Bookbub for a book which is in KU. So it can be done, although I think a lot of it is about genre. In Regency romance, there are typically two offerings a day, one free and one 99c or more. That means twice as many slots as in some genres, and they're more likely to have a lull where they're happy to take a KU book to fill in a gap.

Interestingly, although it took me 60 submissions to get my first Bookbub, it got easier after that. At one point I had five straight submissions accepted without a rejection. It's got harder the last year or two, though. This time I had two rejections before they accepted one. They turned down my two never-before-discounted offers, one of them a good value box set, in favour of a book they ran just over a year ago. So I have no more idea than anyone else why they accept one book over another. I think a lot of it is just happenstance - catching them on a day when yours is the most appealing option. It has *nothing* to do with the quality of the book. Good books get rejected multiple times, less good get accepted, all without rhyme or reason.

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #146 on: April 23, 2021, 09:43:57 PM »
So if I try to raise the price on Amazon tonight, it won't do anything for three days?  :icon_think:

I guess I don't mind all that much because sales are still coming in on Amazon, presumably from people finally opening their sales newsletters.

I raised a price on a book yesterday. Every platform is up other than Amazon.

Amazon is pretending to price match by saying it's discounting the full price digital to 99c.

They are not price matching. They are lying. The book is at 5.99 everywhere.

Now I have to wait 3 days to tell them to fix it, which they will have to do because they're lying...again.

This happens every single time.

And people wonder why I won't touch Vella when Amazon prove every day that they either can't be trusted or they're not competent. Take your pick.
Do you distribute through D2D? It can take a while for those to go through. What I've done is instead of just asking Amazon to change the price I ask them where the price is still 99 cents because I can't find it. Once they told me it was B&N. I had them on the phone. I looked at it and said I don't understand, I'm looking at it, and it is okay. I've had to do this a couple of times. So when you go back to them make sure you say you have checked everywhere and it looks like the price is $X.99 and you need to know specifically where it is still 0.99 so you can change it. Hope that helps. Good luck.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #147 on: April 23, 2021, 10:05:32 PM »
The only way to get a bigger audience in another country, barring blind luck or amazon algos, is to advertise there.  And the cheapest way to advertise is Bookbub.

(Eta: I typed out a very similar reply 2-3 weeks ago, then deleted it as I so often do. I have to remind myself it's not my place to convince or advise others, but then again I feel like I need to post an alternate point of view.)


I just got the post-bookbub email from BB asking how it went and giving me a few pointers on extending the warm glow of sales.  Point two or three was 'apply for another bookbub' so I did.


« Last Edit: April 23, 2021, 10:07:57 PM by Simon Haynes »
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #148 on: April 23, 2021, 10:10:42 PM »
Of course, you can play the price match game by dropping it to 99c a few days ahead of time on other retailers... When the Zon price-matches, it doesn't change the payout percentage... Risky? Sure. Just sayin'  :cool:

When you pick the 70% royalty rate there used to be a T&C stating that you confirmed you were not listing the book anywhere else cheaper. I have no idea whether it's still there, but it's not something I'd risk my account over. The 30% rate didn't have the same requirement.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #149 on: April 24, 2021, 01:35:53 AM »
I agree it's a game, an annoying one, but I know up front I'll have to call them and act like I'm too dumb to figure out where the price is still 0.99 so can they please help me out and tell me. Thank you so much, what would I ever do without you.

Are you in the US? You can get them to call you on author central and take care of it over the phone rather than waiting the three days to try email again.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #150 on: April 24, 2021, 07:19:23 AM »
That's how you know worrying works. Most of the stuff I worry about never happens.
 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #151 on: April 24, 2021, 07:34:19 AM »
I noticed something interesting on the Bookbub website today. The average downloads for my genre used to be 24,600. Now it's 18,200. That's a 25% drop. Big difference. They still charge the same fee, though. Grin

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #152 on: April 24, 2021, 08:03:48 AM »
That's how you know worrying works. Most of the stuff I worry about never happens.

Lol. How come worrying didn't work the other 10 times in the past year? It all started going horribly wrong in March last year. This is the first time the price went up without me having to hassle Amazon since then.

However, if whining on Tim's forum works, then I'm going to keep doing that.  Grin
I guess I'm better at it than you. A lifetime of practice.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #153 on: April 25, 2021, 01:38:25 AM »
The price went right back up this morning even though I only asked at midnight last night. No issue there. 

I did apply for another BookBub as suggested, for a different title. I can't seriously believe they'll say yes, but since I have proof that even an international ad can make a profit, I'm trying again.

I agree that BB doesn't care if a book is well written. If it seems plausible--good cover, on target for subgenre, etc.--they'll run it even though many of the reviews will say, "This is the worst book this author has written." That includes trad pub books.

I was hoping my recent run would provide more Amazon reviews. Instead, one review that Amazon had deleted has been restored.  :dizzy
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #154 on: April 27, 2021, 07:48:05 AM »
Still waiting for BookBub to reject my latest attempt. I guess they get a lot over the weekend and it takes a day or so to sort through them.

Meanwhile, I discovered that Google Play not only did not automatically return my book's price to normal, but it delisted the book. This does not help with a tail, folks.

I've manually fixed it, I hope. Part of the site says it's available and part hasn't caught up and isn't counting it in my total list of titles. Fun and games.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #155 on: April 27, 2021, 10:21:28 PM »


This is probably a bit late, but have you tried the online support Google chat. They usually fix anything I need on the spot. No need to wait.

Also, have you noticed problems with Apple. I can't get into the back end of my books to set up pricing for my latest release, so every other platform is live except for Apple. Real pain in the butt because I have campaigns running for it.

I did not see a live chat feature on Google Play. I've looked again just now and don't see it. Where is it located? My book's listing there is correct now.

I had such a wretched time struggling with pricing on Apple that years ago I switched to going through D2D to Apple. Happy to avoid the hassle. I do have one book left that's direct, but since I never change its price, I don't have an answer for you.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2021, 12:14:09 AM by LilyBLily »
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #156 on: April 28, 2021, 07:27:18 PM »
Still waiting for BookBub to reject my latest attempt. I guess they get a lot over the weekend and it takes a day or so to sort through them.

Meanwhile, I discovered that Google Play not only did not automatically return my book's price to normal, but it delisted the book. This does not help with a tail, folks.

I've manually fixed it, I hope. Part of the site says it's available and part hasn't caught up and isn't counting it in my total list of titles. Fun and games.

It's been five days for me and no rejection yet (scifi space opera, wide).

I'm guessing they're waiting to see if something better comes along.  Most scifi space opera is in KU, so I guess that's something in my favour.

 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #157 on: April 28, 2021, 09:17:15 PM »
It's been five days for me and no rejection yet (scifi space opera, wide).

I'm guessing they're waiting to see if something better comes along.  Most scifi space opera is in KU, so I guess that's something in my favour.

Five days is a very good sign. It means they're considering it. It might still get rejected but it's not a hard pass, anyway. Fingers crossed for you!

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes, LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #158 on: April 28, 2021, 10:58:38 PM »
While I wait to be rejected/accepted for the next BookBub ad, I noticed something about the book that just ran the international BB ad. It now has four more ratings (not reviews). I don't know if this is good or bad. Probably good. After the first few reviews, unless there's something in a story that sticks out like a sore thumb, everybody says the same thing, anyway. And if something does stick out, they say the same thing with different pejoratives. I must admit I find those reviews entertaining.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #159 on: April 29, 2021, 11:06:41 PM »
Holy moley! I got another international BookBub! Yikes!
 
The following users thanked this post: PaulineMRoss, VanessaC, cecilia_writer, Gerri Attrick, JackT

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #160 on: April 29, 2021, 11:11:04 PM »
Congratulations!
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #161 on: April 29, 2021, 11:34:50 PM »
Me too! International only (non-US)

I've seen an awful lot of big-name authors/books in my Bookbub emails lately, and as I suggested earlier in this thread, that has to be leaving more room for international-only deals. Publishers based in Au/Ca/UK/In can't use Bookbub featured deals unless they hold the rights in all those countries, which almost never happens. So, US publishers are cherry picking the US slots, and that leaves room for indies.

Works for me.
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily, Gerri Attrick, JackT

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #162 on: April 29, 2021, 11:42:13 PM »
So here's my question. Someone suggested that I should have immediately pressed for a U.S. ad with the same book that had the international deal this month, and for sure BB would have given me that deal. Do we really think that's what's happening now?

Instead, I submitted a different book. I tend to agree with Simon that the trad pub ads are pushing the indie ads to international, but my concern is that if or when BB finally agrees to a U.S. deal, the supporting ads I bought and will buy for the international deals will have drawn off some of the U.S. sales potential. Is BB's mailing list still so wonderful that even if stacked newsletter ads produce nothing much the U.S. BB ad alone will be profitable?
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #163 on: April 30, 2021, 12:51:56 AM »
I've never tried to 'hold back' the US edition at full price while dropping the intl ones to 99c, in order to apply for a US bookbub 30 days after the intl one. I think the chances of getting a US-only BB are slim indeed.

I prefer to drop the price across the board and book promos elsewhere for the US market. I don't cycle back to apply for a BB with that particular book for 6-12 months at least.

(My last BB, and this one, are for titles I've never run a promo for even though they were released in 2018/2019.)

 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

JackT

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #164 on: April 30, 2021, 02:01:54 AM »
I've always made a substantial profit on US only deals; and I haven't ever tried stacking them. I am going to give it a go next month, though.

Is it better to have the smaller promotions before or after the big day? Or a couple before and a couple after? I've got a six day window, with the Bookbub on Day 3.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #165 on: April 30, 2021, 04:15:10 AM »
I've always made a substantial profit on US only deals; and I haven't ever tried stacking them. I am going to give it a go next month, though.

Is it better to have the smaller promotions before or after the big day? Or a couple before and a couple after? I've got a six day window, with the Bookbub on Day 3.

Since the purpose these days of stacking is to keep Amazon from freaking out on the day of the BookBub spike and taking your book off sale, you certainly want some promos before. I don't know if after is worth paying for. Might be the moment to send out your own newsletter, tweet, do Instagram or Facebook posts, that sort of social media. 
 
The following users thanked this post: JackT

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #166 on: April 30, 2021, 08:10:17 AM »
Bknights on Fiverr is like $12 if you want a pre bookbub boost for not a lot of money.
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily, JackT

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #167 on: April 30, 2021, 06:08:29 PM »
So here's my question. Someone suggested that I should have immediately pressed for a U.S. ad with the same book that had the international deal this month, and for sure BB would have given me that deal. Do we really think that's what's happening now?

Instead, I submitted a different book. I tend to agree with Simon that the trad pub ads are pushing the indie ads to international, but my concern is that if or when BB finally agrees to a U.S. deal, the supporting ads I bought and will buy for the international deals will have drawn off some of the U.S. sales potential. Is BB's mailing list still so wonderful that even if stacked newsletter ads produce nothing much the U.S. BB ad alone will be profitable?

For info, in case it's helpful. I applied for a US-only BB deal for the book that had run on the international-only BB deal this month, and was rejected within a day or so. From memory, I think a lot of people who've had international-only deals have then had success with applying for a US-only deal, but it's certainly not guaranteed (of course - nothing is!).

I've been really happy with the international BB deal, though - I continue to see a nice trickle of sales on the discounted box set and, even better, significantly higher page reads than normal for that box set, plus overall increased sales and page reads on my other books and a few more pre-orders on my next release. So it's going to be - for me - a profitable month.





     



Genre: Fantasy
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #168 on: April 30, 2021, 09:44:52 PM »
You guys have inspired me to apply again with the book they accepted for Int'l before. I've sold 8 copies of it YTD. I've got nothing to lose. It has nice reviews from UK readers, it really seemed to resonate with people there.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2021, 09:58:09 PM by notthatamanda »
 
The following users thanked this post: Simon Haynes

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #169 on: May 01, 2021, 12:09:08 AM »
You guys have inspired me to apply again with the book they accepted for Int'l before. I've sold 8 copies of it YTD. I've got nothing to lose. It has nice reviews from UK readers, it really seemed to resonate with people there.

Good idea. I had to put submitting on my to-do list and force myself to keep trying. By becoming indies we avoid direct rejections from agents and editors, but we still are rejection avoidant.   
 

RPatton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #170 on: May 01, 2021, 04:24:23 AM »
To add, Book Doggy is only $18 and I saw really nice results with it, which could give you a nice bump pre-Bookbub.
 
The following users thanked this post: JackT

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #171 on: May 02, 2021, 06:52:21 AM »
Rejected. 48 hour turn around.
 
The following users thanked this post: Doglover

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #172 on: May 02, 2021, 02:11:08 PM »
Rejected. 48 hour turn around.

Darn. Maybe next time.  :smilie_zauber:
 
The following users thanked this post: notthatamanda

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #173 on: May 03, 2021, 08:13:57 PM »
 
The following users thanked this post: notthatamanda

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #174 on: May 04, 2021, 05:47:53 AM »
Rejected. 48 hour turn around.
Me too. I think I've had two rejections since the thread started.  :tap
 :cheers Never surrender, Amanda.
 
The following users thanked this post: notthatamanda

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #175 on: May 04, 2021, 05:57:45 AM »
Rejected. 48 hour turn around.
Me too. I think I've had two rejections since the thread started.  :tap
 :cheers Never surrender, Amanda.

Two? Piker  :icon_cool:
I'm waiting for rejection number twelve since this thread started. Had a few heart palpitations last week when it took them five days to reject.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #176 on: May 04, 2021, 10:11:47 AM »
Ha, ha! Maybe I need to up the ante. I'll keep applying  :tap
 

R. C.

  • Long Novel unlocked
  • ***
  • Posts: 973
  • Thanked: 320 times
  • Gender: Male
  • "Sooner barbarity than boredom." - T. Gautier
    • Ruairí Cinéad Ducantlin - Writer of Stories
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #177 on: May 06, 2021, 11:29:25 PM »
Received my second BB rejection today. Does that mean I can apply to join the club? Is there a minimum number of rejections to apply for club membership?

 :doh:

Cheers,
R.C.
↓↓↓ Latest Creation ↓↓↓
 

 
R.C. Ducantlin
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #178 on: May 06, 2021, 11:52:39 PM »
I think I've got over a hundred. You may join but you are still a prawn, no offense. We all have to start somewhere.
 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #179 on: May 07, 2021, 01:47:59 AM »
I racked up 60 rejections before I got an acceptance, so keep applying, folks!

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 

JackT

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #180 on: May 07, 2021, 01:59:53 AM »
I've lost count. It must be 30 or 40 at least.
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #181 on: May 07, 2021, 02:12:51 AM »
My last acceptance was in February 2020. Since then, I've racked up 70 rejections.
 

TimothyEllis

  • Forum Owner
  • Administrator
  • Series unlocked
  • ******
  • Posts: 5638
  • Thanked: 2203 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Earth Galaxy core, 2618
    • The Hunter Imperium Universe
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #182 on: May 07, 2021, 02:16:33 AM »
I racked up 60 rejections before I got an acceptance, so keep applying, folks!
I've lost count. It must be 30 or 40 at least.
My last acceptance was in February 2020. Since then, I've racked up 70 rejections.

 :HB  :dizzy  :shrug

I just don't have that kind of devotion to getting one.

I completely gave up after about a dozen.

With all the talk of Indies only getting Intl ones, I don't see the point of even bothering.

But good luck to those of you who never give up.  :tap
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



Timothy Ellis Kindle Author page. | Join the Hunter Legacy mailing list | The Hunter Imperium Universe on Facebook. | Forum Promo Page.
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #183 on: May 07, 2021, 02:43:30 AM »
:HB  :dizzy  :shrug

I just don't have that kind of devotion to getting one.

I completely gave up after about a dozen.

With all the talk of Indies only getting Intl ones, I don't see the point of even bothering.

But good luck to those of you who never give up.  :tap

It literally takes me five minutes per month. I have five series and submit the first in each every four weeks, like clockwork. I'm hoping they'll give me a featured deal eventually if only so I'll stop submitting  grint
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #184 on: May 07, 2021, 03:33:08 AM »
I used to be a little bit more regular about it. Now it's just when people are talking about it a lot here and I can pretend I'm doing work.
 

Simon Haynes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #185 on: May 07, 2021, 03:35:49 AM »
Over the past few months I've had four rejections in a row, four acceptances in a row.

It's not so much about your book, rather it's related to what they've already lined up.  If they have a load of epic fantasy books and someone offers something a little different it has a much higher chance.

My acceptances were scifi comedy, light scifi adventure, gaslamp fantasy and mil scifi (only one of them in KU)
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #186 on: May 07, 2021, 04:59:54 AM »
Eh, no worries. Am I ever going to get a romance bookbub? Probably not. If they accept me I'll probably take it as a sign that Bookbub is in its last days. My romance is competing against books with 100s of reviews with a 4.9+* average. I'm low 4s with 70 or so reviews. It will never happen.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #187 on: May 07, 2021, 05:58:05 AM »
Yeah, I was contemplating rebranding them as women's fiction. Can't justify the cost of the new covers though.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #188 on: May 07, 2021, 09:47:53 AM »
I haven't submitted often--and BookBub helpfully keeps a list of my submissions, so now I know it was a total of eleven--and they've passed on this next book twice before. I think Simon has the right of it and their people pick and choose based on what other books they're got lined up.

My assumption is that the trad pub women's fiction, with its typical $1.99 or $2.99 as the discount price, is the preferred deal for BookBub. Since there is plenty of trad pub backlist to pump through the system, I doubt I could ever get a U.S. deal. I'd do a 99-cent deal and accepting my book in place of a trad pub book means $751 or $1522 in lost revenue for BB. I can't see why BB would go for that.

On the other hand, if BB wants to keep giving me international deals, and the ads each make a small profit, then I can use that profit to fund other ads that might be even more profitable. At the moment I'm soured on Amazon ads and not ready to try yet again with Facebook.

 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #189 on: May 16, 2021, 09:02:53 AM »
The run-up to my international BookBub on Monday has begun. I'll spare you the details this time around. So far, the first paid newsletter ad (non-international, AFAIK) has produced enough sales to amortize the cost of the ad and make a tiny profit. Score!
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #190 on: May 16, 2021, 11:43:51 AM »
Nice! Congratulations.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #191 on: May 16, 2021, 12:38:03 PM »
Congrats, Lily! :dance:
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #192 on: May 17, 2021, 05:28:12 AM »
Here's a question for those of you with experience. Does the very first newsletter ad in a stacked sequence produce the most sales? This time around I've carefully separated out the newsletter ads to one per day and no social media alerts, the purpose being to see exactly which ones produced sales. But the truth is that without a tracking pixel I have no way of knowing if a sale today is from the newsletter that hit yesterday or from today's ad. Similarly, after the BookBub tomorrow, there will be people who only look at the email on Tuesday or Wednesday, and I have other ads scheduled for those two days. So I won't really know exactly how many sales can be attributed to the BookBub newsletter alone.

This time around I've remembered to checking my book's rankings, which is entertainment. grint Haven't seen those numbers in a while.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #193 on: May 17, 2021, 05:47:09 AM »
Does the very first newsletter ad in a stacked sequence produce the most sales?
.
No. Sometimes I prime a big sale and can see the start of sales, but, in my opinion, the sales depend on the popularity of the newsletter, not the order in which it is released by day or time.

There's not much of a way to track it, but there's much less sales on a tail the following day (except from Bookbub). Usually I find the newsletter of the day is leading to the vast majority of your daily sales.

Only a few promotion companies fair better after the first day with a tail. Books Butterfly & The Portalist, for example, do well, if not better, on the second day--I think because they rely on multiple mailouts rather than one single email.
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #194 on: May 17, 2021, 12:02:44 PM »
On the ever helpful partners blog, BookBub gives nine reasons a book was rejected:

https://insights.bookbub.com/reasons-book-rejected-bookbub-featured-deal

My problem is #7--not enough platform, specifically reviews. So we have that famous chicken-egg conundrum: Not enough sales to interest BookBub in increasing my books' sales, not enough reviews to interest BookBub in increasing my books' review count.

I guess I can use that thousand dollars I won't be spending on a BookBub ad for a lot of Facebook ads or something. Or maybe I'm supposed to hunt up and pay for a couple hundred reviews. That's a great use of ad money, just give the book away to a thousand people and hope I get a hundred new reviews. Or two hundred. Actually, it's hard to find a service that can give away that many books on the direct hope/assumption the recipient will review it. Straight book giveaways have not worked for me at all; I can give away a couple thousand books and get zero reviews.

Last week I had 23 requests for a free copy of one of my titles through a company that says it has a 75% review rate. So far, no new reviews. In my personal experience, if I don't read a book as soon as I download it, I probably won't read it ever, so I am not hopeful that 75% will apply to my book.

I'm committed to asking BookBub once a month every month this year, anyway. They might have an off moment and want my thousand dollars after all.
If it is any comfort, reviews don't always help. They just turned down one of my novels that has more than a thousand reviews. 🤷‍♀️

I would totally skip Bookbub if I could find a platform that gave even close to the same results. AMS definitely doesn't for me. I have been stacking smaller advertisers with some results, but nothing exactly spectacular. It can be frustrating.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #195 on: May 17, 2021, 02:56:36 PM »
That is so frustrating. You have plenty of proof that your book is pleasing to many readers.

I think Simon is right that BB is simply matching its category needs with its remaining openings after taking the bigger money offered by trad pubs to run ads for their backlist titles.

I was wrong about number of reviews being meaningful to BookBub. BB offered me the first international ad on a title that had a mere nine reviews. The international ad and all my supporting U.S. newsletter ads garnered the book fourteen additional ratings. At this point I think if the ratings increase, having more reviews will not matter. Potential readers will see the total number, maybe read a few of the reviews, and make up their minds.

It's tough to know we must advertise and yet have so few ways to do it effectively. This second international BB I've got running May 17 will likely earn me a net of a couple hundred dollars--and that is nothing compared to the thousands that my old Amazon ads used to earn on one title alone. 

« Last Edit: May 17, 2021, 10:46:21 PM by LilyBLily »
 

PaulineMRoss

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #196 on: May 17, 2021, 04:32:42 PM »
Here's a question for those of you with experience. Does the very first newsletter ad in a stacked sequence produce the most sales? This time around I've carefully separated out the newsletter ads to one per day and no social media alerts, the purpose being to see exactly which ones produced sales. But the truth is that without a tracking pixel I have no way of knowing if a sale today is from the newsletter that hit yesterday or from today's ad. Similarly, after the BookBub tomorrow, there will be people who only look at the email on Tuesday or Wednesday, and I have other ads scheduled for those two days. So I won't really know exactly how many sales can be attributed to the BookBub newsletter alone.

This time around I've remembered to checking my book's rankings, which is entertainment. grint Haven't seen those numbers in a while.

I've found in the past when I've had a Bookbub without any other promo that the first day is the big hit, the second day produces about a quarter of that, the third day a quarter of day 2 and so on. Other promo sites seem to be similar. So you could use that as a very rough rule of thumb. But Bookbub dwarfs anything else.

Writing epic fantasy as Pauline M Ross; writing Regency romance as Mary Kingswood
Bookbub score: 13 for 89
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #197 on: May 17, 2021, 08:47:13 PM »
That is so frustrating. You have plenty of proof that your book is pleasing to many readers.

I think Simon is right that BB is simply matching its category needs with its remaining openings after taking the bigger money offered by trad pubs to run ads for their backlist titles.

I was wrong about number of reviews being meaningful to BookBub. BB offered me the first international ad on a title that had a mere nine reviews. The international ad and all my supporting U.S. newsletter ads garnered the book fourteen additional ratings. At this point I think if the ratings increase, having more reviews will not matter. Potential readers will see the total number, maybe read a few of the reviews, and make up their minds.

It's tough to know we must advertise and yet have so few ways to do it effectively. This second international BB I've got running May 17 will likely earn me a net of a couple hundreds dollars--and that is nothing compared to the thousands that my old Amazon ads used to earn on one title alone.
It's like pushing a boulder up a hill, except the boulder keeps getting bigger and the hill keeps getting steeper.
 

Crystal

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #198 on: May 18, 2021, 08:15:23 AM »
There are good AMS kws still but it's specific to the book. If you can really target similar covers or themes, specific themes not broad ones like bad boys or billionaires, you can get a decent ACoS. I wouldn't expect to make a profit on a standalone. But on a series of 2-3+ it's doable.
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #199 on: May 18, 2021, 09:24:37 AM »
Here's a question for those of you with experience. Does the very first newsletter ad in a stacked sequence produce the most sales? This time around I've carefully separated out the newsletter ads to one per day and no social media alerts, the purpose being to see exactly which ones produced sales. But the truth is that without a tracking pixel I have no way of knowing if a sale today is from the newsletter that hit yesterday or from today's ad. Similarly, after the BookBub tomorrow, there will be people who only look at the email on Tuesday or Wednesday, and I have other ads scheduled for those two days. So I won't really know exactly how many sales can be attributed to the BookBub newsletter alone.

This time around I've remembered to checking my book's rankings, which is entertainment. grint Haven't seen those numbers in a while.

I've found in the past when I've had a Bookbub without any other promo that the first day is the big hit, the second day produces about a quarter of that, the third day a quarter of day 2 and so on. Other promo sites seem to be similar. So you could use that as a very rough rule of thumb. But Bookbub dwarfs anything else.
It is definitely more effective to stack it with a few smaller advertisers. The first trick, of course, is getting the BB. I have lost track of how many I have had over the years, certainly more than a dozen. Twenty, maybe? But I still can't count on them and not being able to PLAN your advertising campaigns puts us at a huge disadvantage.

AMS as far as I am concerned can never be more than a drip campaign. I see no way to really build a platform using it.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #200 on: May 22, 2021, 10:45:12 AM »
Here are the raw results of my international BookBub earlier this week: about 200 more sales than last month's, and so far a handful of full price sales of other titles. Just a sprinkling, not an avalanche.

As far as I can tell, the true international sales were 100 over BookBub's average. I am not well versed on the exact dollar figures involved at all the various stores, so I'm merely guessing that this ad will earn a profit of maybe $70-$100 more than the first one did. Canadian readers were getting a super deal and bought heavily. 

The ad stack winner was eReader IQ, which brought in 64 sales before the BookBub ad and only cost $10. BookDoggy ($20), FKBT ($30), and my newsletter ($7 per month, paid annually) each accounted for far fewer sales.

I expect to get a letter from Bookbub next week urging me to submit another title, and I will. I have one more women's fiction title that should work for the same audience.

Paying close attention to this was a good distraction during my last bit of self-imposed quarantine. 
 
 
The following users thanked this post: idontknowyet, VanessaC, JackT, alhawke

Pemry Janes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #201 on: May 23, 2021, 04:32:28 PM »
Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.
Genre: Fantasy
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #202 on: May 23, 2021, 10:25:24 PM »
Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.

Good luck! If you haven't done so already, check out Nick Erik's roundup of promo sites: https://nicholaserik.com/promo-sites/
 
The following users thanked this post: Pemry Janes

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #203 on: May 23, 2021, 10:30:09 PM »
Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.
Good luck.
 
The following users thanked this post: Pemry Janes

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #204 on: May 24, 2021, 12:09:03 AM »
Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian.
Good luck!
For genre specific, you might also want to have a look at Fantasy Book Deals. I had a $.99 fantasy promo with them last week that cost $15. Iit's well worth checking out for the cost of the promo. {edit: had 6 sales with their promo
« Last Edit: May 24, 2021, 12:13:15 AM by alhawke »
 
The following users thanked this post: Pemry Janes

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #205 on: May 25, 2021, 12:15:40 AM »
Let the countdown begin. I've applied for another BookBub. I applied for the whole deal, not just international.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #206 on: May 25, 2021, 01:24:00 AM »
Good luck.
 

Gerri Attrick

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #207 on: May 25, 2021, 02:46:37 AM »
Good luck, Lily.

I hope to apply for my first full BookBub fairly soon (had a couple of Internationals I was pleased with, but that's a few years back). I'll let you know how it goes.
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #208 on: May 26, 2021, 12:26:52 PM »
Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.
David Gaughran gives some good advice on advertising. You might check out this blog post.

https://davidgaughran.com/best-promo-sites-books/
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton, Pemry Janes

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #209 on: May 27, 2021, 11:24:04 PM »
I got another international BookBub!  :banana:
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #210 on: May 27, 2021, 11:49:50 PM »
Congrats, LilyBlily! :banana-riding-llama-smiley-em
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #211 on: May 28, 2021, 01:52:24 AM »
Congratulations!
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #212 on: May 28, 2021, 05:04:22 AM »
Thanks. Now I have a little time in which to decide whether it is worth my while to buy at least three other newsletter ads to stack. Did that last time but only one seemed to pull its weight. The profitability of an international BookBub ad is not such that one can go hog wild with additional ads.
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #213 on: May 28, 2021, 05:50:09 AM »
The fact that most newsletters don't have an international reach is an issue. I'm reducing the US price on mine as well and hoping that the two that I scheduled will pay for themselves. I just wish there was a way of planning our advertising campaigns instead of their being so catch-as-catch-can. But that is an impossible dream.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #214 on: May 28, 2021, 06:41:35 AM »
The fact that most newsletters don't have an international reach is an issue. I'm reducing the US price on mine as well and hoping that the two that I scheduled will pay for themselves. I just wish there was a way of planning our advertising campaigns instead of their being so catch-as-catch-can. But that is an impossible dream.

You raise a very good point. Everything else connected with self-publishing is quite logical and basically simple even though there are many steps involved. Advertising feels like a game of 52 Pick-Up. 
 
The following users thanked this post: JRTomlin

Pemry Janes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #215 on: May 28, 2021, 05:42:16 PM »
Congratulations!

And I took your advice alhawke and now also have a promotion scheduled with Fantasy Book Deals.
Genre: Fantasy
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

VanessaC

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #216 on: May 28, 2021, 08:30:27 PM »
I got another international BookBub!  :banana:

Congratulations! You're on a roll - hope this one does well for you, too.
     



Genre: Fantasy
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #217 on: May 29, 2021, 01:42:09 AM »
I got another international BookBub!  :banana:

Congratulations! You're on a roll - hope this one does well for you, too.

Thanks. This time I'm taking BookBub's advice to make the sale period short at all venues. BB claims that produces more full-price sales. We shall see. 

The profits involved for these international ads are minor by comparison to what my U.S. Amazon ads and my KU books earned me several years ago. Unfortunately, their efficacy has long since flatlined. These BB ads are a wonderful shot in the arm as well as seed money for more production expenses.   

I do feel I'm on a roll, but I only have one other published women's fiction novel, and I need to work on getting it many more reviews. Probably I must rewrite the blurb yet again, too. Oh, joy.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #218 on: May 29, 2021, 05:11:03 AM »
This time I'm taking BookBub's advice to make the sale period short at all venues. BB claims that produces more full-price sales. We shall see. 
Let us know. IME, the sales right after a BB launch are not high enough to make back enough money so you're usually better off just building rank and continuing the sale. Most money was earned from other books in the series for me.

The other problem I've had with this strategy is that it's very hard for Amazon to return the price to regular price if you're wide. I griped about this on Writersanctum last year. If you're not in KU, you can expect a five to seven day lag to change the price back to normal.

It all doesn't matter much, anyway. You did it. Way to go! Two BB back to back, if I read the thread correctly, right?  :cheers
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #219 on: May 29, 2021, 09:22:41 AM »
Actually--amazingly!--three. April, May, June. All international. Each book is a stand-alone, but they are well branded. 

I expected trouble getting my Amazon prices back up but so far have not had any issues. This might be because I ended the sale prices on the wide venues several days earlier than on Amazon. I'll probably do the same again. 

 
« Last Edit: June 08, 2021, 09:47:05 AM by LilyBLily »
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #220 on: May 29, 2021, 09:29:06 AM »
Ending the wide prices a couple of days before Amazon works for me as well. They want to see the other prices back up before they raise theirs.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #221 on: May 29, 2021, 12:00:56 PM »
Actually--amazingly!--three. April, May, June. All international.
Three? Wow! Fantastic work. I guess I won't hesitate to apply more frequently after an acceptance. I'd never have thought you could land them back to back like that. I'm beginning to think reviews or timing or whatever else we think makes a difference is similar to a Baseball player's superstitious charm. Landing one is more like the Editor's whim.
Ending the wide prices a couple of days before Amazon works for me as well.
I do this regularly now but still have to frequently contact them  :icon_sad:
« Last Edit: May 29, 2021, 12:05:35 PM by alhawke »
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #222 on: May 29, 2021, 12:47:58 PM »
As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #223 on: May 29, 2021, 01:33:52 PM »
I think many of us hesitate to apply, especially after we've just gotten rejected. I tried to take my feelings out of it by setting a goal this year of applying every month and ignoring the astronomical odds against me.

I got rejected in January and February on the same titles they accepted in April and May. Somehow the timing has worked in my favor very recently but there was absolutely no change in those titles between the rejections and the acceptances.

We're left with questions that the ever helpful BookBub blog does not answer. When I started this thread I was sure the low number of ratings/reviews on my titles was a serious negative, but that proved not to be the case.

Because most of us stack ads or social media around any BookBub deals--and often around any other newsletter ads--it's hard to know what the pure results of a BB ad are. Yet BB knows how many clicks there were and cites an average number of sales. Neither number is made available to us advertisers, though, on a case-by-case basis. That data would be very useful information to have. BB is not so different from Amazon after all.
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #224 on: May 29, 2021, 01:55:03 PM »
One of the things I do to try to get a better idea of how my various retailers actually do is schedule them on different days. There will still be some overlap but it gives at least some hint of which ones are giving a ROI and which aren't.
 

Pemry Janes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #225 on: May 29, 2021, 04:31:12 PM »
As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.
I had wondered about that, what is the preferred way to change the price for the promotion if you're wide? Just go in and change it manually in Amazon or send them a Price Match message?
Genre: Fantasy
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #226 on: May 29, 2021, 10:28:52 PM »
I changed the price manually.
 
The following users thanked this post: Pemry Janes

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #227 on: May 30, 2021, 01:36:09 AM »
Just raised the price to two of my books. Waited three days. Nothing. Then emailed Amazon and received the message:
"I checked and confirm that the price of your books has been updated to $4.99 on Amazon website."
It's $3.99 on Amazon :HB
I suppose the thing for me to do now with my high blood pressure is to just ignore the whole thing. I'm trying.
(on a positive note, another book that was changed got a sale two days ago the day it was listed as $3.99 $4.99 so perhaps our lack of control is not all a bad thing).
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #228 on: May 30, 2021, 08:49:13 AM »
Just raised the price to two of my books. Waited three days. Nothing. Then emailed Amazon and received the message:
"I checked and confirm that the price of your books has been updated to $4.99 on Amazon website."
It's $3.99 on Amazon :HB
I suppose the thing for me to do now with my high blood pressure is to just ignore the whole thing. I'm trying.
(on a positive note, another book that was changed got a sale two days ago the day it was listed as $3.99 $4.99 so perhaps our lack of control is not all a bad thing).
That could mean that the price is set to $4.99 on your bookshelf but they are still price matching. I'll try to find my email to them that finally got the job done and PM you.

Nope, never mind the PM. They sent me a list of links to prove it wasn't free anymore but it was so I said:

The first link says the book is free.Please change it back to $2.99 on
amazon.com and to the corresponding price on all the other platforms if it says
free anywhere else.Thanks for your help. Amanda
« Last Edit: May 30, 2021, 08:51:39 AM by notthatamanda »
 
The following users thanked this post: alhawke

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #229 on: May 30, 2021, 12:28:25 PM »
I wanted to raise it quicker to see if I could nudge a BB application (true & apropos for the thread). But ... rejected anyway. So now there's no rush. Back to applying next month. Never give up.  Grin
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #230 on: May 30, 2021, 01:51:08 PM »
As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.
I had wondered about that, what is the preferred way to change the price for the promotion if you're wide? Just go in and change it manually in Amazon or send them a Price Match message?
It depends I suppose. I got in the habit of having Amazon doing it because you have to if you're reducing it to free. It also shows as price reduced if they do it which is nice advertising. On the other hand, obviously doing it yourself gives you more control BUT if you do it yourself, don't raise your Amazon price until all the other prices are raised or there is a good chance Amazon will price match to the lower price before the higher goes through. Arrrrgh They will pick then to be super-efficient. You can bet on it.
 
The following users thanked this post: Pemry Janes

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #231 on: May 30, 2021, 02:08:35 PM »
I wanted to raise it quicker to see if I could nudge a BB application (true & apropos for the thread). But ... rejected anyway. So now there's no rush. Back to applying next month. Never give up.  Grin

Definitely keep trying.

I've heard this advice often and ignored it for years. This year I finally was persistent and it has paid off. I'm sure you'll get accepted sooner or later. The only way to make it sooner is to keep applying. Duh.
 

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #232 on: May 31, 2021, 02:32:40 PM »
Congrats, Lily!   :dog1:

You've inspired me to try again.  I'm going for Chick Lit International this time.  We'll see what happens!

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #233 on: June 05, 2021, 04:28:05 AM »
And...no.  I think I'm going to stop applying and focus on other things.  Like summer!   :dog1:

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #234 on: June 05, 2021, 06:29:39 AM »
Sorry to hear that. BookBub isn't the only game, though.

I've got my ad stack ready for later this month and now I'm focusing on trying to get more reviews of my fourth women's fiction, in anticipation of submitting that title after this next international BookBub. I very much doubt I'd get a fourth international BookBub but the possibility is motivating me to make an effort. Unfortunately, what Tim has discovered about blurb copy on Amazon being a complete formatting nightmare daunts me from changing the ebook blurb, which luckily is not messed up but could be improved upon. The paperback blurb copy is a wreck. I attempted to change it in Author Central and am not surprised that nothing changed. I'm going to try to change it again, using KDP, but I don't have high hopes.
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #235 on: June 05, 2021, 06:49:52 AM »
And...no.  I think I'm going to stop applying and focus on other things.  Like summer!   :dog1:
Enjoy!  :cheers

 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #236 on: June 05, 2021, 08:14:11 AM »
My garden will be happy with this decision! LOL

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 

Eric Thomson

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #237 on: June 05, 2021, 09:33:24 AM »
I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton, LilyBLily

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #238 on: June 05, 2021, 10:58:54 AM »
I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

Congrats, Eric!

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #239 on: June 05, 2021, 10:28:59 PM »
I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.
Good luck with the audio series!
 

Pemry Janes

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #240 on: June 06, 2021, 04:44:07 PM »
I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.
Congratulations on getting that deal.

In my own news, the bump from Book Barbarian has come and gone. Didn't earn my money back but given the low numbers I was happy to see how many picked up the sequel at full price. I had scheduled Fantasybook Deals right after, but apparently they had a technical problem and the newsletter didn't go out. So I'm going to reschedule there.

All in all, I think I will repeat this experiment again once the third book is out.
Genre: Fantasy
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #241 on: June 06, 2021, 10:16:37 PM »
I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

You're not missing much. I've had two this year and I won't be bothering again. They were profitable, but not by enough to bother with. Now they barely ever give us full features, I've pretty much written off BookBub as a tactic. The international only is simply not worth it. Might as well use click ads (PPC). They're cheap, easy to control, and they result in steady sales rather than a spike. That said, both AMS and BookBub PPC are too expensive unless you're in KU.

Most newsletter ads are unprofitable on the face of it, and repetition of those ads dulls the reception and becomes less and less profitable. If they don't produce a tail they're also a waste of time and all the energy involved in applying to each one and coordinating KU sale periods. The newsletter ads I did earlier this year did have some effect but that was temporary and in some cases (Fussy Librarian) pretty close to nonexistent. I suppose after throwing away money repeatedly on each newsletter, one might get a sense of what each one's audience prefers, but that's a very expensive method of gathering data. It also isn't a tactic for the long haul. Advertising to the same relatively small group of people over and over again will get less and less profitable judged on any basis.

PPC ads always were much more effective since they reach a much larger audience, but PPC ads on Amazon are no longer cheap nor easy to control. Amazon ads' algorithm changes have destroyed what used to be a steady drip of sales and reads. I am at a loss for what tactic will work next on a steady basis. I do intend to try Facebook ads yet again and will likely do BookBub PPC ads again, too.
 
 

R. C.

  • Long Novel unlocked
  • ***
  • Posts: 973
  • Thanked: 320 times
  • Gender: Male
  • "Sooner barbarity than boredom." - T. Gautier
    • Ruairí Cinéad Ducantlin - Writer of Stories
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #242 on: June 06, 2021, 10:48:02 PM »
...

I gave up on AMS years ago (Amazon may have the reach, but the content mills have pushed cost per click way too high) and I gave up on BookBub PPC ads (they cost way too much for what you can sell).

I switched to Google 12 months ago. This year I created multiple ads (that's multiple tag lines, headers, images, and text) for all the books I promote. I'm now running through the sets for each book. Google run all the combinations of images, headers, tags, and text, then tell you how successful the combinations are. You can decide which combinations you to use based on how many conversions you're getting. I also set up ads by country, so now I can drive traffic to my web page from specific countries.

...

Are you finding success with Google ADs?  I found Google ADs (Video and Search) to be less effective than FB Video ADs. 

ALTHOUGH - Nothing is performing well in this summer slump.

Yes, FB is a quagmire of idiotic political BS.

R.C.
↓↓↓ Latest Creation ↓↓↓
 

 
R.C. Ducantlin
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #243 on: June 07, 2021, 12:30:08 AM »
Opinion on the best tutorials for Google Ads? I'm looking at Loves Data on YouTube.
 

R. C.

  • Long Novel unlocked
  • ***
  • Posts: 973
  • Thanked: 320 times
  • Gender: Male
  • "Sooner barbarity than boredom." - T. Gautier
    • Ruairí Cinéad Ducantlin - Writer of Stories
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #244 on: June 07, 2021, 01:06:58 AM »
Opinion on the best tutorials for Google Ads? I'm looking at Loves Data on YouTube.

Cain't recommend a tutorial.  I started playing around after setting up a business account.  The most important thing is to ensure your bid/budget/optimization is constrained.  Everything within the tool is designed to "enhance" your spend.

FYI - I am running new "Display" (aka Video) ADs on Google as of this morning. Time will tell...

R.C.
↓↓↓ Latest Creation ↓↓↓
 

 
R.C. Ducantlin
 

Lorri Moulton

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #245 on: June 07, 2021, 07:50:58 AM »
I've had great results with Fussy Librarian...even after repeatedly promoting the same Free first in series book.

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Lass Books
 
The following users thanked this post: R. C.

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #246 on: June 07, 2021, 09:33:26 AM »
I've had great results with Fussy Librarian...even after repeatedly promoting the same Free first in series book.

This is why advice should always come with YMMV. We get different results because we are not selling widgets but unique reading experiences.
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton, R. C.

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #247 on: June 08, 2021, 10:04:17 AM »
My two titles that had international BookBubs have been receiving new ratings (not reviews). The first has 22 new so far. The second has over 40 new. Their ratings averages have been increasing, too, from 4.0 to 4.2 in one case.

When I consider that I paid $65 to NetGalley for what ended up as maybe 7 reviews directly linked to the service and posted on Amazon (more were posted on Goodreads), getting all these new ratings is a huge bonus in social proof.

In the future, I may ask my newsletter list to rate rather than to review. Reviewing is work. Rating is one click.
 

TimothyEllis

  • Forum Owner
  • Administrator
  • Series unlocked
  • ******
  • Posts: 5638
  • Thanked: 2203 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Earth Galaxy core, 2618
    • The Hunter Imperium Universe
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #248 on: June 08, 2021, 11:39:23 AM »
My two titles that had international BookBubs have been receiving new ratings (not reviews). The first has 22 new so far. The second has over 40 new.

It looks to me as if Amazon is pushing ratings again.

My current book has significantly higher now than any of the last three. There's no reason for that other than before that, Amazon was pushing ratings and then stopped. So they must be doing it again now.
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



Timothy Ellis Kindle Author page. | Join the Hunter Legacy mailing list | The Hunter Imperium Universe on Facebook. | Forum Promo Page.
 

notthatamanda

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #249 on: June 08, 2021, 11:47:55 AM »
You mean pushing readers to leave ratings?
 

TimothyEllis

  • Forum Owner
  • Administrator
  • Series unlocked
  • ******
  • Posts: 5638
  • Thanked: 2203 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Earth Galaxy core, 2618
    • The Hunter Imperium Universe
Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #250 on: June 08, 2021, 12:02:30 PM »
You mean pushing readers to leave ratings?

Yes.

More aggressive about asking for a rating when a reader gets to the end of a book.

I'm not sure how, but I'd guess that a lot of readers currently think they have to do a rating now. Like back when we got a lot of crap reviews because readers thought they had to do one.
Genres: Space Opera/Fantasy/Cyberpunk, with elements of LitRPG and GameLit, with a touch of the Supernatural. Also Spiritual and Games.



Timothy Ellis Kindle Author page. | Join the Hunter Legacy mailing list | The Hunter Imperium Universe on Facebook. | Forum Promo Page.
 

JRTomlin

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #251 on: June 09, 2021, 04:41:10 AM »
Getting mainly ratings rather than reviews is a bit of a problem with new novels. I had plenty of ratings but few reviews on one of mine. Well, it happened a very negative review (that I am pretty sure was actually for a different novel since the comments did not apply to mine) stayed at the top of the reviews for weeks. In the meantime, I got a lot of good ratings that of course did not push it down.

My 99¢ int'l BB promo that cost $204 ran yesterday. I supported it with about $100 advertising on BB and eReaderIQ. Counting sell-through to the rest of the series the sales have been $285. So I haven't reached the break-even point, but it's getting close. The price reduction lasts for one more day and the BB ad is still running and I'm still getting sales from the BB promo it looks like, so I am hopeful it will at least break even. Any RoI will take a while for more sell-though. Still, I've done worse on ad campaigns.
 

LilyBLily

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #252 on: June 09, 2021, 07:54:13 AM »
Getting mainly ratings rather than reviews is a bit of a problem with new novels. I had plenty of ratings but few reviews on one of mine. Well, it happened a very negative review (that I am pretty sure was actually for a different novel since the comments did not apply to mine) stayed at the top of the reviews for weeks. In the meantime, I got a lot of good ratings that of course did not push it down.

My 99¢ int'l BB promo that cost $204 ran yesterday. I supported it with about $100 advertising on BB and eReaderIQ. Counting sell-through to the rest of the series the sales have been $285. So I haven't reached the break-even point, but it's getting close. The price reduction lasts for one more day and the BB ad is still running and I'm still getting sales from the BB promo it looks like, so I am hopeful it will at least break even. Any RoI will take a while for more sell-though. Still, I've done worse on ad campaigns.

I hope your numbers will draw ahead. Even a very small tail should do it. I'm still seeing a sale here or there on wide venues where I couldn't get arrested previously.

It never occurred to me to support the international ads with a U.S. BookBub PPC ad. I'll have to think about that. The problem is controlling the costs, but if the book is already discounted I've already done most of the work of a wide ad and it could be worth the risk.

As to my books with new ratings, they already had some decent reviews (and enough meh reviews to be credible). Of course I would prefer a bunch of thoughtful, enthusiastic, and new reviews, but I'll take what I can get.
 

alhawke

Re: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub
« Reply #253 on: June 09, 2021, 11:21:40 AM »
My 99¢ int'l BB promo that cost $204 ran yesterday. I supported it with about $100 advertising on BB and eReaderIQ. Counting sell-through to the rest of the series the sales have been $285. So I haven't reached the break-even point, but it's getting close.
Congrats! Sounds like you did great. I agree with LilBLily--your tail should pull you far ahead.
 
The following users thanked this post: JRTomlin

LilyBLily