Author Topic: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub (Read 76838 times)

VanessaC · « **Reply #100 on:** April 16, 2021, 12:24:03 AM »

Quote from: Simon Haynes on April 14, 2021, 07:12:36 PM

I have an international-only bookbub on the 16th April (A Riddle in Bronze, which is a gaslamp fantasy in the Paranormal Suspense BB category).

I've never run a promotion for this or reduced the price before so I'm interested to see how it goes.

I've also reduced the US price to 99c and booked nine promos of various kinds for that market. I think the first of those kicks off tonight.

Good luck for your interenational bookbub!

LilyBLily · « **Reply #101 on:** April 16, 2021, 04:32:03 AM »

Day 1 54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2 10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3 12 sales from B&N
52 sales from Kobo
204 sales from Amazon--which seems a apt number since $204 was the price of the ad.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #102 on:** April 16, 2021, 05:42:25 AM »

Congratulations.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #103 on:** April 16, 2021, 07:33:33 AM »

Day 1 54 sales. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a respectable 22 sales from FKBT.
Day 2 10 sales from Book Doggy. I don't call that a success.
Day 3 12 sales from B&N--remarkable, considering B&N doesn't do international anymore.
58 sales from Kobo
0 sales from Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)
238 sales from Amazon
Total so far: 372 sales, or nearly half of what is needed to break even.

BookBub kindly sent me at my request a screen shot of the ad--with the copy they wrote to promote it. That sales copy is probably worth all that I have spent so far. You can bet I'm going to copy it word for word when I apply for a U.S. BookBub for this title.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #104 on:** April 16, 2021, 07:43:34 AM »

If you are talking about the bookbub blurb, you can see it on your bookbub page, or at least you used to be able to. I only ever had an Intl bookbub and I took note of it. I was similarly impressed with the one they did for me.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #105 on:** April 16, 2021, 11:14:27 AM »

Day 1 April 13 54 sales Amazon, 12 sales B&N. Assuming all 32 clicks from my newsletter resulted in sales leaves a more than respectable 34 sales from FKBT ad. (Repositioned the B&N sales as they all occurred on Apr 13.)
Day 2 April 14 10 sales Amazon from Book Doggy ad. I don't call that a success.
Day 3 April 15 All sales from international BookBub ad
71 sales Kobo
257 sales Amazon
0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Total as of 9 PM EDT: 404 sales, or more than half of what is needed to break even.

I'd be happy to reach 425 by end of day, but that may not happen. I myself don't usually open my daily BB newsletter the day it arrives, so I do assume a tail. So far, no sell through to other titles, but this sale is for a stand-alone title, not a series starter.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #106 on:** April 16, 2021, 02:11:28 PM »

Day 1 April 13 54 sales Amazon Ad on FKBT, and my newsletter
12 sales B&N
Day 2 April 14 10 sales Amazon Ad on Book Doggy
Day 3 April 15 Ad on International BookBub
71 sales Kobo
263 sales Amazon
0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Day 4 April 16 At 12 AM EDT, both Amazon and Kobo have rolled over to the next day despite Amazon usually using Pacific time.
84 sales Amazon
6 sales Kobo

Total so far: 500 sales

To come later on April 16, ad on eReaderIQ

notthatamanda · « **Reply #107 on:** April 16, 2021, 08:23:10 PM »

LilyBLily · « **Reply #108 on:** April 16, 2021, 10:23:45 PM »

Day 1 April 13 54 sales Amazon Ad on FKBT, plus my newsletter
12 sales B&N
Day 2 April 14 10 sales Amazon Ad on Book Doggy
Day 3 April 15 Ad on International BookBub
71 sales Kobo
263 sales Amazon
0 sales reported by Google Play and Draft2Digital (for Apple)--some could be delayed
Day 4 April 16 At 8 AM EDT
108 sales Amazon
10 sales Kobo

Total so far: 528 sales

To come later today, ad on eReaderIQ

By my calculations the breakeven is 776 sales, depending on currency fluctuations.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #109 on:** April 17, 2021, 12:28:38 AM »

More revisions as lag reporting plays a role:

Day 1 April 13 54 sales Amazon Ad on FKBT, plus my newsletter
12 sales B&N
Day 2 April 14 10 sales Amazon Ad on Book Doggy--maybe not a loser after all?
15 sales B&N
Day 3 April 15 Ad on International BookBub
71 sales Kobo
263 sales Amazon
67 sales reported by Draft2Digital for Apple
? sales to come B&N reported Saturday or Monday?
Day 4 April 16 At 10 AM EDT
111 sales Amazon
12 sales Kobo

Total so far: 615 sales

To come later today, ad on eReaderIQ--I'm not subscribed, so I'm not sure if it has dropped yet.

By my calculations the breakeven is 776 sales, depending on currency fluctuations.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #110 on:** April 17, 2021, 10:27:03 PM »

Didn't want to bore anyone with the slower stats yesterday, much as they interested me. Google Play did finally report a handful of sales, and B&N did report this morning even though it's a weekend, as did D2D for Apple sales. The promotion is officially in positive dollars as of 8 AM EDT. I had miscalculated the royalty amounts granted in the non-Amazon stores, but even so, the totals already exceed my initial breakeven number of 776.

Bookbub's average sales for this category: 760

My book's sales so far:

502 Amazon
125 Apple
95 Kobo
56 B&N
13 Google Play

Total: 791

So, technically, this promo is a success.

Woo-hoo!

Maggie Ann · « **Reply #111 on:** April 17, 2021, 11:17:35 PM »

notthatamanda · « **Reply #112 on:** April 18, 2021, 01:35:48 AM »

Yay! Maybe you picked up some new fans too.

Simon Haynes · « **Reply #113 on:** April 18, 2021, 04:02:39 AM »

My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #114 on:** April 18, 2021, 06:42:22 AM »

Congratulations!

LilyBLily · « **Reply #115 on:** April 18, 2021, 07:55:57 AM »

Quote from: Simon Haynes on April 18, 2021, 04:02:39 AM

My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.

That's good news.

Maggie Ann · « **Reply #116 on:** April 18, 2021, 09:02:24 AM »

Quote from: Simon Haynes on April 18, 2021, 04:02:39 AM

My BB in Supernatural Suspense has been running about a day and a bit, and I'm sitting on 380 or so international sales for that book. BB's expected for the category is 410 and I'll easily pass that over the next few days. It was a smaller category than fantasy or scifi, which I usually go for, but I applied for it because I felt it fitted the niche better.

Jeff Tanyard · « **Reply #117 on:** April 18, 2021, 10:17:53 AM »

Congrats, Lily and Simon!

Simon Haynes · « **Reply #118 on:** April 18, 2021, 08:30:41 PM »

540 now. Another 210 in the US from the other stacked promos (with a couple more to come). The stacked promos cost me $175 US and the BB was $120 from memory.

I only have 1st day figures for Apple and Google, as they always lag a bit. Kobo performed well as usual, with most of the sales in Canada.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #119 on:** April 18, 2021, 10:52:27 PM »

Great! Happy for you.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #120 on:** April 18, 2021, 10:58:19 PM »

That's excellent. You're really chugging past the expected number.

JackT · « **Reply #121 on:** April 18, 2021, 11:37:27 PM »

Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #122 on:** April 18, 2021, 11:53:14 PM »

Quote from: JackT on April 18, 2021, 11:37:27 PM

Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months.

I know that's the received wisdom, but we've already advertised our books on U.S. newsletters, and surely BookBub can only count clicks from its ads and check our rankings on certain days?

So if, say, the direct clicks from the BookBub ad for my book only equaled or neared their average--even though the clicks from other newsletters produced many more sales and created a profit--why would BookBub think our books were good candidates for what would be in essence a repeat sale in the U.S.?

Seriously wondering. What has been other people's recent experience?

JackT · « **Reply #123 on:** April 19, 2021, 12:03:05 AM »

I had an international Bookbub in February for a later-in-series book. It did reasonably well - getting the average number of sales Bookbub suggested - and I've just secured a US deal for next month (yay!).

I had another international earlier this month, on a standalone book, which did slightly less well. It will be interesting to see if that one gets a deal in July/August.

Both books were available in the US, at 0.99, but I didn't do anything to promote them there.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #124 on:** April 19, 2021, 12:43:37 AM »

Quote from: LilyBLily on April 18, 2021, 11:53:14 PM

Quote from: JackT on April 18, 2021, 11:37:27 PM
Congrats, both of you! Should be a shoo-in for a US deal in 2-3 months.

I know that's the received wisdom, but we've already advertised our books on U.S. newsletters, and surely BookBub can only count clicks from its ads and check our rankings on certain days?

So if, say, the direct clicks from the BookBub ad for my book only equaled or neared their average--even though the clicks from other newsletters produced many more sales and created a profit--why would BookBub think our books were good candidates for what would be in essence a repeat sale in the U.S.?

Seriously wondering. What has been other people's recent experience?

Not recent, but I had a very good Int'l bookbub Dec 2018 and they never accepted me for a US one.

VanessaC · « **Reply #125 on:** April 19, 2021, 08:10:35 PM »

Congratulations to LilyBLily and Simon Haynes for what sound like successful international bookbubs.

My own international bookbub ran yesterday - 18 April. This was a 5 book complete series box-set, normally 8.99 and reduced to 0.99 for April.

18 April - 453 sales
19 April (so far) - 177 sales

So a total of 630 sales to date, which I'm delighted with (per Bookbub's own stats, I think the average for fantasy is 460 or thereabouts). Depending on exchange rates, I should also be in profit, which is an unexpected bonus.

The box set also broke into the top 100 paid on Amazon UK, which is another nice bonus, and is sitting high in some of its sub-categories (side note: I might need to look at the categories again, as the UK ones don't look quite right).

A lovely start to the week. Hope everyone else is having a good day.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #126 on:** April 19, 2021, 09:09:48 PM »

Great results Vanessa! Congratulations. I think I'll go apply again.

Doglover · « **Reply #127 on:** April 19, 2021, 09:22:40 PM »

I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #128 on:** April 19, 2021, 11:36:02 PM »

Quote from: Doglover on April 19, 2021, 09:22:40 PM

I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.

It brought some excitement into my humdrum lockdown life.

You have many titles to choose from. Many of the books featured on BB are not first in series, which runs contrary to the received wisdom about only advertising the first book. My book had only nine reviews, again contrary to the intimidating "thousands of 5-star reviews on Goodreads" that BB often touts. You might as well just pick one and go for it. As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #129 on:** April 20, 2021, 06:57:38 AM »

Quote from: Doglover on April 19, 2021, 09:22:40 PM

I've never applied for a Bookbub. I have, of course, heard much about it but I've always shied away. Perhaps later on I'll give it some thought, although what to advertise I cannot imagine.

Your best bet is the first book in your series that has the best read through. Not to imply that is your best bet to get accepted, but that's probably your best bet to make money.

TimothyEllis · « **Reply #130 on:** April 20, 2021, 11:58:00 AM »

Quote from: LilyBLily on April 19, 2021, 11:36:02 PM

As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

That only follows if someone's home market is their primary market, or at least is significant.

When the US is 70-80% of your income, international BB's make no sense.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #131 on:** April 20, 2021, 02:00:13 PM »

Quote from: TimothyEllis on April 20, 2021, 11:58:00 AM

Quote from: LilyBLily on April 19, 2021, 11:36:02 PM
As I recall you're in the UK, so an international-only BB might be very good for continued sales.

That only follows if someone's home market is their primary market, or at least is significant.

When the US is 70-80% of your income, international BB's make no sense.

As long as an ad pays for itself, surely it does make sense--unless you think that the typical support method of stacking US newsletter ads destroys prospects for a successful US BookBub ad. I won't know about that unless I actually get a US BB ad, and that is hardly a given.

TimothyEllis · « **Reply #132 on:** April 20, 2021, 02:14:16 PM »

Quote from: LilyBLily on April 20, 2021, 02:00:13 PM

As long as an ad pays for itself, surely it does make sense

I guess I look at ads differently.

To my way of thinking, if an ad fails to produce a decent profit, then that ad was a failure.

I've had just 1 Intl BB on a book 7. Everyone told me it did well, but I've always viewed it as a total failure, and I'll never do another one.

Ads breaking even is not a rationale for doing them imo.

Sorry, that's just the way I think.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #133 on:** April 20, 2021, 10:58:37 PM »

For several years, I was very satisfied with the return on my continuous Amazon ads. Then they tanked. Click price has doubled or tripled, which means zero direct profit on the ads. As I've discussed elsewhere, an algorithm change has resulted in search terms Amazon sends to my ad suddenly being terms I've specifically listed as negative that shouldn't be sent at all. Lots of expensive and useless clicks resulting in no sales.

Please do not claim that my Amazon ads still would be successful if only I came up with amazing keywords that no one else has discovered yet romance fans are ravenously responsive to. Romance is an intensely crowded field and I defy anyone to prove that there are any such keywords.

So this year my strategy has changed, and my tactic is to use one-day newsletter ads and see where that gets me. Go look for a new audience. This seems reasonable to me as a beginning step. So far it has been moderately successful in generating reads for my books in KU. This international BookBub may work a similar magic with my wide women's fiction. Or it may not, but at least it hasn't cratered my ad budget.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #134 on:** April 20, 2021, 11:28:41 PM »

Yeah, I agree. I spent a month of evenings with a trial of a keyword software package trying to find the magic combination of searched a lot but not expensive. Couldn't do it and returned the software.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #135 on:** April 21, 2021, 01:34:45 AM »

Quote from: Tweek on April 20, 2021, 11:56:55 PM

I haven't used Amazon ads since 2016/17. Too expensive, over complicated, and I'm wide, so I prefer ads that promote multiple platforms.

I don't use newsletters. My various mail lists don't do a lot for me. I think it might be my reader demographic. They don't respond much to newsletters, if at all really.

I need advertising tactics that aren't too expensive, run 24/7, preferably promote all platforms, don't take up much of my time to manage, simple to set up and use, are in my control to run as often and whenever I want, and keep my sales churning with a profit margin.

As for keywords, in my personal opinion people can end up wasting a huge amount of time and money fiddling with keywords for marginal gain.

Late 2016 is when huge numbers of us jumped into the Amazon ads pool and drove the click prices up. I felt it was necessary since at the beginning of 2016 I could release a book and it would immediately sell with no ads. By late 2016, none of my books were were selling, and my new books didn't cause a ripple. So I dove into AMS ads and got an immediate boost in sales that continued for several years. Now, meh. Hence a new strategy.

Keywords that seem completely logical for what a book is can signal to Amazon that it's a different kind of book entirely. I released a Gothic romance that is not a "dark" "Mafia" "biker" "street" romance. That's where Amazon wants to advertise it. Much easier to accurately hype the book in a newsletter ad.

I agree that some newsletters are unresponsive depending on the genre and unfortunately my own personal newsletter is more a tax write-off than a powerful engine to get sales.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #136 on:** April 21, 2021, 02:19:27 AM »

I hope Lily doesn't mind me posting this here but add another Bookbub rejection to my total.

LilyBLily · « **Reply #137 on:** April 21, 2021, 04:24:26 AM »

This can be our misery thread. No problem about posting another BB rejection.

Lorri Moulton · « **Reply #138 on:** April 21, 2021, 12:31:18 PM »

Sorry Amanda. :(

VanessaC · « **Reply #139 on:** April 21, 2021, 07:56:41 PM »

Quote from: notthatamanda on April 21, 2021, 02:19:27 AM

I hope Lily doesn't mind me posting this here but add another Bookbub rejection to my total.

Sorry to hear that. Even if you're half-expecting it, it's still disappointing.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #140 on:** April 21, 2021, 09:12:18 PM »

Thanks guys, no worries. I'm all about the next big thing and that would be Radish. ;)

LilyBLily · « **Reply #141 on:** April 23, 2021, 07:12:33 AM »

A week after the international BookBub, sales are still dripping in, including more today from B&N (reporting sales of two days ago) than the day before. So it's not a perfect slide to nothing, and meanwhile a couple of full price sales have happened. All the venues have now reverted to the regular price, although I did have to change Google Play manually despite the sale price end date having expired. I'll revert Amazon's price late tonight.

BookBub has asked for feedback. With over 1k sales and a few more to go, this ad was not life-changing (does that happen anymore?) but the numbers are comfortably above BB's average. That gives me hope that maybe a domestic featured ad might be possible in a few months. BB meanwhile is pushing me to buy PPC ads. I think I'd like to see the profits for this ad run first.

Eric Thomson · « **Reply #142 on:** April 23, 2021, 08:28:34 AM »

Quote from: Tweek on April 23, 2021, 07:32:01 AM

I'm just setting up for the international BookBub and I noticed if I set the book to 99c on the international sites, Amazon change the royalty to 30% even for the full price book on the US site.

Is this new?

Nope. Always been like that. You either meet the minimum threshold for 70% in all Zon stores, or you get 35% everywhere.

Eric Thomson · « **Reply #143 on:** April 23, 2021, 08:46:44 AM »

Quote from: Tweek on April 23, 2021, 08:30:58 AM

Quote from: Eric Thomson on April 23, 2021, 08:28:34 AM
Quote from: Tweek on April 23, 2021, 07:32:01 AM
I'm just setting up for the international BookBub and I noticed if I set the book to 99c on the international sites, Amazon change the royalty to 30% even for the full price book on the US site.

Is this new?
Nope. Always been like that. You either meet the minimum threshold for 70% in all Zon stores, or you get 35% everywhere.

Thanks. I don't usually only discount international only and, the few times I have, I never noticed that.

Sucks.

Of course, you can play the price match game by dropping it to 99c a few days ahead of time on other retailers... When the Zon price-matches, it doesn't change the payout percentage... Risky? Sure. Just sayin'

LilyBLily · « **Reply #144 on:** April 23, 2021, 10:59:06 AM »

So if I try to raise the price on Amazon tonight, it won't do anything for three days?

I guess I don't mind all that much because sales are still coming in on Amazon, presumably from people finally opening their sales newsletters.

PaulineMRoss · « **Reply #145 on:** April 23, 2021, 08:46:25 PM »

To add another data point to this thread: I just got accepted for an all-areas free Bookbub for a book which is in KU. So it can be done, although I think a lot of it is about genre. In Regency romance, there are typically two offerings a day, one free and one 99c or more. That means twice as many slots as in some genres, and they're more likely to have a lull where they're happy to take a KU book to fill in a gap.

Interestingly, although it took me 60 submissions to get my first Bookbub, it got easier after that. At one point I had five straight submissions accepted without a rejection. It's got harder the last year or two, though. This time I had two rejections before they accepted one. They turned down my two never-before-discounted offers, one of them a good value box set, in favour of a book they ran just over a year ago. So I have no more idea than anyone else why they accept one book over another. I think a lot of it is just happenstance - catching them on a day when yours is the most appealing option. It has *nothing* to do with the quality of the book. Good books get rejected multiple times, less good get accepted, all without rhyme or reason.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #146 on:** April 23, 2021, 09:43:57 PM »

Quote from: Tweek on April 23, 2021, 07:30:25 PM

Quote from: LilyBLily on April 23, 2021, 10:59:06 AM
So if I try to raise the price on Amazon tonight, it won't do anything for three days?

I guess I don't mind all that much because sales are still coming in on Amazon, presumably from people finally opening their sales newsletters.

I raised a price on a book yesterday. Every platform is up other than Amazon.

Amazon is pretending to price match by saying it's discounting the full price digital to 99c.

They are not price matching. They are lying. The book is at 5.99 everywhere.

Now I have to wait 3 days to tell them to fix it, which they will have to do because they're lying...again.

This happens every single time.

And people wonder why I won't touch Vella when Amazon prove every day that they either can't be trusted or they're not competent. Take your pick.

Do you distribute through D2D? It can take a while for those to go through. What I've done is instead of just asking Amazon to change the price I ask them where the price is still 99 cents because I can't find it. Once they told me it was B&N. I had them on the phone. I looked at it and said I don't understand, I'm looking at it, and it is okay. I've had to do this a couple of times. So when you go back to them make sure you say you have checked everywhere and it looks like the price is $X.99 and you need to know specifically where it is still 0.99 so you can change it. Hope that helps. Good luck.

Simon Haynes · « **Reply #147 on:** April 23, 2021, 10:05:32 PM »

The only way to get a bigger audience in another country, barring blind luck or amazon algos, is to advertise there. And the cheapest way to advertise is Bookbub.

(Eta: I typed out a very similar reply 2-3 weeks ago, then deleted it as I so often do. I have to remind myself it's not my place to convince or advise others, but then again I feel like I need to post an alternate point of view.)

I just got the post-bookbub email from BB asking how it went and giving me a few pointers on extending the warm glow of sales. Point two or three was 'apply for another bookbub' so I did.

Simon Haynes · « **Reply #148 on:** April 23, 2021, 10:10:42 PM »

Quote from: Eric Thomson on April 23, 2021, 08:46:44 AM

Of course, you can play the price match game by dropping it to 99c a few days ahead of time on other retailers... When the Zon price-matches, it doesn't change the payout percentage... Risky? Sure. Just sayin'

When you pick the 70% royalty rate there used to be a T&C stating that you confirmed you were not listing the book anywhere else cheaper. I have no idea whether it's still there, but it's not something I'd risk my account over. The 30% rate didn't have the same requirement.

notthatamanda · « **Reply #149 on:** April 24, 2021, 01:35:53 AM »

I agree it's a game, an annoying one, but I know up front I'll have to call them and act like I'm too dumb to figure out where the price is still 0.99 so can they please help me out and tell me. Thank you so much, what would I ever do without you.

Are you in the US? You can get them to call you on author central and take care of it over the phone rather than waiting the three days to try email again.

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Author Topic: Now I know why I will never get a BookBub (Read 76838 times)