Now I know why I will never get a BookBub

[LilyBLily]

Here are the raw results of my international BookBub earlier this week: about 200 more sales than last month's, and so far a handful of full price sales of other titles. Just a sprinkling, not an avalanche.

As far as I can tell, the true international sales were 100 over BookBub's average. I am not well versed on the exact dollar figures involved at all the various stores, so I'm merely guessing that this ad will earn a profit of maybe $70-$100 more than the first one did. Canadian readers were getting a super deal and bought heavily. 

The ad stack winner was eReader IQ, which brought in 64 sales before the BookBub ad and only cost $10. BookDoggy ($20), FKBT ($30), and my newsletter ($7 per month, paid annually) each accounted for far fewer sales.

I expect to get a letter from Bookbub next week urging me to submit another title, and I will. I have one more women's fiction title that should work for the same audience.

Paying close attention to this was a good distraction during my last bit of self-imposed quarantine. 
 

[Pemry Janes]

Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.

[LilyBLily]

Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.

Good luck! If you haven't done so already, check out Nick Erik's roundup of promo sites: https://nicholaserik.com/promo-sites/

[notthatamanda]

Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.

Good luck.

[alhawke]

Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian.

Good luck!
For genre specific, you might also want to have a look at Fantasy Book Deals. I had a $.99 fantasy promo with them last week that cost $15. Iit's well worth checking out for the cost of the promo. {edit: had 6 sales with their promo

[LilyBLily]

Let the countdown begin. I've applied for another BookBub. I applied for the whole deal, not just international.

[notthatamanda]

Good luck.

[Gerri Attrick]

Good luck, Lily.

I hope to apply for my first full BookBub fairly soon (had a couple of Internationals I was pleased with, but that's a few years back). I'll let you know how it goes.

[JRTomlin]

Hadn't tried much of any marketing so far, but given that my third book in the series is coming out in a couple of months I thought this was a good time to step up my game there. Reading this topic helped and doing some more research I've applied for Book Barbarian. I also got accepted.

Here's hoping for some success.

David Gaughran gives some good advice on advertising. You might check out this blog post.

https://davidgaughran.com/best-promo-sites-books/

[LilyBLily]

I got another international BookBub! 

[alhawke]

Congrats, LilyBlily!

[notthatamanda]

Congratulations!

[LilyBLily]

Thanks. Now I have a little time in which to decide whether it is worth my while to buy at least three other newsletter ads to stack. Did that last time but only one seemed to pull its weight. The profitability of an international BookBub ad is not such that one can go hog wild with additional ads.

[JRTomlin]

The fact that most newsletters don't have an international reach is an issue. I'm reducing the US price on mine as well and hoping that the two that I scheduled will pay for themselves. I just wish there was a way of planning our advertising campaigns instead of their being so catch-as-catch-can. But that is an impossible dream.

[LilyBLily]

The fact that most newsletters don't have an international reach is an issue. I'm reducing the US price on mine as well and hoping that the two that I scheduled will pay for themselves. I just wish there was a way of planning our advertising campaigns instead of their being so catch-as-catch-can. But that is an impossible dream.

You raise a very good point. Everything else connected with self-publishing is quite logical and basically simple even though there are many steps involved. Advertising feels like a game of 52 Pick-Up. 

[Pemry Janes]

Congratulations!

And I took your advice alhawke and now also have a promotion scheduled with Fantasy Book Deals.

[VanessaC]

I got another international BookBub! 

Congratulations! You're on a roll - hope this one does well for you, too.

[LilyBLily]

I got another international BookBub! 

Congratulations! You're on a roll - hope this one does well for you, too.

Thanks. This time I'm taking BookBub's advice to make the sale period short at all venues. BB claims that produces more full-price sales. We shall see. 

The profits involved for these international ads are minor by comparison to what my U.S. Amazon ads and my KU books earned me several years ago. Unfortunately, their efficacy has long since flatlined. These BB ads are a wonderful shot in the arm as well as seed money for more production expenses.   

I do feel I'm on a roll, but I only have one other published women's fiction novel, and I need to work on getting it many more reviews. Probably I must rewrite the blurb yet again, too. Oh, joy.

[alhawke]

This time I'm taking BookBub's advice to make the sale period short at all venues. BB claims that produces more full-price sales. We shall see. 

Let us know. IME, the sales right after a BB launch are not high enough to make back enough money so you're usually better off just building rank and continuing the sale. Most money was earned from other books in the series for me.

The other problem I've had with this strategy is that it's very hard for Amazon to return the price to regular price if you're wide. I griped about this on Writersanctum last year. If you're not in KU, you can expect a five to seven day lag to change the price back to normal.

It all doesn't matter much, anyway. You did it. Way to go! Two BB back to back, if I read the thread correctly, right? 

[LilyBLily]

Actually--amazingly!--three. April, May, June. All international. Each book is a stand-alone, but they are well branded. 

I expected trouble getting my Amazon prices back up but so far have not had any issues. This might be because I ended the sale prices on the wide venues several days earlier than on Amazon. I'll probably do the same again. 

 

[JRTomlin]

Ending the wide prices a couple of days before Amazon works for me as well. They want to see the other prices back up before they raise theirs.

[alhawke]

Actually--amazingly!--three. April, May, June. All international.

Three? Wow! Fantastic work. I guess I won't hesitate to apply more frequently after an acceptance. I'd never have thought you could land them back to back like that. I'm beginning to think reviews or timing or whatever else we think makes a difference is similar to a Baseball player's superstitious charm. Landing one is more like the Editor's whim.

Ending the wide prices a couple of days before Amazon works for me as well.

I do this regularly now but still have to frequently contact them 

[JRTomlin]

As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.

[LilyBLily]

I think many of us hesitate to apply, especially after we've just gotten rejected. I tried to take my feelings out of it by setting a goal this year of applying every month and ignoring the astronomical odds against me.

I got rejected in January and February on the same titles they accepted in April and May. Somehow the timing has worked in my favor very recently but there was absolutely no change in those titles between the rejections and the acceptances.

We're left with questions that the ever helpful BookBub blog does not answer. When I started this thread I was sure the low number of ratings/reviews on my titles was a serious negative, but that proved not to be the case.

Because most of us stack ads or social media around any BookBub deals--and often around any other newsletter ads--it's hard to know what the pure results of a BB ad are. Yet BB knows how many clicks there were and cites an average number of sales. Neither number is made available to us advertisers, though, on a case-by-case basis. That data would be very useful information to have. BB is not so different from Amazon after all.

[JRTomlin]

One of the things I do to try to get a better idea of how my various retailers actually do is schedule them on different days. There will still be some overlap but it gives at least some hint of which ones are giving a ROI and which aren't.

[Pemry Janes]

As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.

I had wondered about that, what is the preferred way to change the price for the promotion if you're wide? Just go in and change it manually in Amazon or send them a Price Match message?

[LilyBLily]

I changed the price manually.

[alhawke]

Just raised the price to two of my books. Waited three days. Nothing. Then emailed Amazon and received the message:
"I checked and confirm that the price of your books has been updated to $4.99 on Amazon website."
It's $3.99 on Amazon
I suppose the thing for me to do now with my high blood pressure is to just ignore the whole thing. I'm trying.
(on a positive note, another book that was changed got a sale two days ago the day it was listed as $3.99 $4.99 so perhaps our lack of control is not all a bad thing).

[notthatamanda]

Just raised the price to two of my books. Waited three days. Nothing. Then emailed Amazon and received the message:
"I checked and confirm that the price of your books has been updated to $4.99 on Amazon website."
It's $3.99 on Amazon
I suppose the thing for me to do now with my high blood pressure is to just ignore the whole thing. I'm trying.
(on a positive note, another book that was changed got a sale two days ago the day it was listed as $3.99 $4.99 so perhaps our lack of control is not all a bad thing).

That could mean that the price is set to $4.99 on your bookshelf but they are still price matching. I'll try to find my email to them that finally got the job done and PM you.

Nope, never mind the PM. They sent me a list of links to prove it wasn't free anymore but it was so I said:

The first link says the book is free.Please change it back to $2.99 on
amazon.com and to the corresponding price on all the other platforms if it says
free anywhere else.Thanks for your help. Amanda

[alhawke]

I wanted to raise it quicker to see if I could nudge a BB application (true & apropos for the thread). But ... rejected anyway. So now there's no rush. Back to applying next month. Never give up. 

[JRTomlin]

As soon as I am sure all the other prices are raised, I send them a Remove Price Match email, including links. I have had good luck with their responding within a day and returning the price to normal. I found that waiting for them to do it on their own did slow things down. It still ends up taking two or three days total for all the prices to go back up.

I had wondered about that, what is the preferred way to change the price for the promotion if you're wide? Just go in and change it manually in Amazon or send them a Price Match message?

It depends I suppose. I got in the habit of having Amazon doing it because you have to if you're reducing it to free. It also shows as price reduced if they do it which is nice advertising. On the other hand, obviously doing it yourself gives you more control BUT if you do it yourself, don't raise your Amazon price until all the other prices are raised or there is a good chance Amazon will price match to the lower price before the higher goes through. Arrrrgh They will pick then to be super-efficient. You can bet on it.

[LilyBLily]

I wanted to raise it quicker to see if I could nudge a BB application (true & apropos for the thread). But ... rejected anyway. So now there's no rush. Back to applying next month. Never give up. 

Definitely keep trying.

I've heard this advice often and ignored it for years. This year I finally was persistent and it has paid off. I'm sure you'll get accepted sooner or later. The only way to make it sooner is to keep applying. Duh.

[Lorri Moulton]

Congrats, Lily!   

You've inspired me to try again.  I'm going for Chick Lit International this time.  We'll see what happens!

[Lorri Moulton]

And...no.  I think I'm going to stop applying and focus on other things.  Like summer!   

[LilyBLily]

Sorry to hear that. BookBub isn't the only game, though.

I've got my ad stack ready for later this month and now I'm focusing on trying to get more reviews of my fourth women's fiction, in anticipation of submitting that title after this next international BookBub. I very much doubt I'd get a fourth international BookBub but the possibility is motivating me to make an effort. Unfortunately, what Tim has discovered about blurb copy on Amazon being a complete formatting nightmare daunts me from changing the ebook blurb, which luckily is not messed up but could be improved upon. The paperback blurb copy is a wreck. I attempted to change it in Author Central and am not surprised that nothing changed. I'm going to try to change it again, using KDP, but I don't have high hopes.

[JRTomlin]

And...no.  I think I'm going to stop applying and focus on other things.  Like summer!   

Enjoy! 

[Lorri Moulton]

My garden will be happy with this decision! LOL

[Eric Thomson]

I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

[Lorri Moulton]

I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

Congrats, Eric!

[notthatamanda]

I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

Good luck with the audio series!

[Pemry Janes]

I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

Congratulations on getting that deal.

In my own news, the bump from Book Barbarian has come and gone. Didn't earn my money back but given the low numbers I was happy to see how many picked up the sequel at full price. I had scheduled Fantasybook Deals right after, but apparently they had a technical problem and the newsletter didn't go out. So I'm going to reschedule there.

All in all, I think I will repeat this experiment again once the third book is out.

[LilyBLily]

I've applied 5 times a month since my last BB in February 2020, with nada to show for it. Not even a miserly international. Considering my sales remain pretty good without the sainted BB, and I've just signed a contract with Tantor Media for the audiobook rights for another of my series, I'll probably reduce my mechanical once a month per series and go with my whim. Their loss, not mine.

You're not missing much. I've had two this year and I won't be bothering again. They were profitable, but not by enough to bother with. Now they barely ever give us full features, I've pretty much written off BookBub as a tactic. The international only is simply not worth it. Might as well use click ads (PPC). They're cheap, easy to control, and they result in steady sales rather than a spike. That said, both AMS and BookBub PPC are too expensive unless you're in KU.

Most newsletter ads are unprofitable on the face of it, and repetition of those ads dulls the reception and becomes less and less profitable. If they don't produce a tail they're also a waste of time and all the energy involved in applying to each one and coordinating KU sale periods. The newsletter ads I did earlier this year did have some effect but that was temporary and in some cases (Fussy Librarian) pretty close to nonexistent. I suppose after throwing away money repeatedly on each newsletter, one might get a sense of what each one's audience prefers, but that's a very expensive method of gathering data. It also isn't a tactic for the long haul. Advertising to the same relatively small group of people over and over again will get less and less profitable judged on any basis.

PPC ads always were much more effective since they reach a much larger audience, but PPC ads on Amazon are no longer cheap nor easy to control. Amazon ads' algorithm changes have destroyed what used to be a steady drip of sales and reads. I am at a loss for what tactic will work next on a steady basis. I do intend to try Facebook ads yet again and will likely do BookBub PPC ads again, too.
 

[R. C.]

...

I gave up on AMS years ago (Amazon may have the reach, but the content mills have pushed cost per click way too high) and I gave up on BookBub PPC ads (they cost way too much for what you can sell).

I switched to Google 12 months ago. This year I created multiple ads (that's multiple tag lines, headers, images, and text) for all the books I promote. I'm now running through the sets for each book. Google run all the combinations of images, headers, tags, and text, then tell you how successful the combinations are. You can decide which combinations you to use based on how many conversions you're getting. I also set up ads by country, so now I can drive traffic to my web page from specific countries.

...

Are you finding success with Google ADs?  I found Google ADs (Video and Search) to be less effective than FB Video ADs. 

ALTHOUGH - Nothing is performing well in this summer slump.

Yes, FB is a quagmire of idiotic political BS.

R.C.

[LilyBLily]

Opinion on the best tutorials for Google Ads? I'm looking at Loves Data on YouTube.

[R. C.]

Opinion on the best tutorials for Google Ads? I'm looking at Loves Data on YouTube.

Cain't recommend a tutorial.  I started playing around after setting up a business account.  The most important thing is to ensure your bid/budget/optimization is constrained.  Everything within the tool is designed to "enhance" your spend.

FYI - I am running new "Display" (aka Video) ADs on Google as of this morning. Time will tell...

R.C.

[Lorri Moulton]

I've had great results with Fussy Librarian...even after repeatedly promoting the same Free first in series book.

[LilyBLily]

I've had great results with Fussy Librarian...even after repeatedly promoting the same Free first in series book.

This is why advice should always come with YMMV. We get different results because we are not selling widgets but unique reading experiences.

[LilyBLily]

My two titles that had international BookBubs have been receiving new ratings (not reviews). The first has 22 new so far. The second has over 40 new. Their ratings averages have been increasing, too, from 4.0 to 4.2 in one case.

When I consider that I paid $65 to NetGalley for what ended up as maybe 7 reviews directly linked to the service and posted on Amazon (more were posted on Goodreads), getting all these new ratings is a huge bonus in social proof.

In the future, I may ask my newsletter list to rate rather than to review. Reviewing is work. Rating is one click.

[TimothyEllis]

My two titles that had international BookBubs have been receiving new ratings (not reviews). The first has 22 new so far. The second has over 40 new.

It looks to me as if Amazon is pushing ratings again.

My current book has significantly higher now than any of the last three. There's no reason for that other than before that, Amazon was pushing ratings and then stopped. So they must be doing it again now.

[notthatamanda]

You mean pushing readers to leave ratings?