Writer Sanctum
Writer's Haven => Writer's Workshop [Public] => Topic started by: Marti Talbott on December 17, 2019, 05:12:43 AM
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While I struggle to think of plots for my books, I seem to have some that I can't or won't use myself. Case in point - the little girl who heard a strange man talking to her in her bedroom. Not sure what kind of device she has, but something like Amazon sells.
So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
Gee, that was years ago. Isn't it time for something about modern technology?
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
Gee, that was years ago. Isn't it time for something about modern technology?
Why? The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
Gee, that was years ago. Isn't it time for something about modern technology?
Why? The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
You're right, it is a stupid idea on my part.
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Do you think Orwell would be amused or depressed by people paying thirty bucks a month for the privilege of being spied on?
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Do you think Orwell would be amused or depressed by people paying thirty bucks a month for the privilege of being spied on?
I think he would be amazed that people are willing to buy and keep paying for it after they know they're being spied on. Which means, he tried, but his book didn't sufficiently warn us. I read it in high school, graduated in 63' and waited for it to come true. 84' came and went, but perhaps he was just off by a few years. grint
Then came Soilent Green, right?
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The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
My daughter gifted me an Alexa device for my birthday. Turns out, I love it, though we can't agree on how to pronounce "Chris Botti". If it's spying on me I don't give a fig. I hope it's spying on my neighbor because I think he's up to something.
But I think some excellent story ideas could arise from an Alexa device gone rogue. It's worth tinkering with, George Orwell be damned.
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I agree, thought to avoid litigation, you'd need to create a fictional device that does something similar. Basic rule with corporations and trademarks: positive and neutral references OK, negative references not.
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I agree, thought to avoid litigation, you'd need to create a fictional device that does something similar. Basic rule with corporations and trademarks: positive and neutral references OK, negative references not.
I've got it - a roving lightning bug. Just kidding.
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The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
My daughter gifted me an Alexa device for my birthday. Turns out, I love it, though we can't agree on how to pronounce "Chris Botti". If it's spying on me I don't give a fig. I hope it's spying on my neighbor because I think he's up to something.
But I think some excellent story ideas could arise from an Alexa device gone rogue. It's worth tinkering with, George Orwell be damned.
+1
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I agree, thought to avoid litigation, you'd need to create a fictional device that does something similar. Basic rule with corporations and trademarks: positive and neutral references OK, negative references not.
I've got it - a roving lightning bug. Just kidding.
Supposedly they have those. They are mini drones. You just have to get closer to the target to control it, because the battery is so small.
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I think it's a good idea. I read 1984 long after 1984, so I never thought much about it as a predictive book. It hits on things that are true about both technology and human nature, which makes it still relevant. But I think a lot of our new technology raises new questions that often go unasked, and those questions should be asked. I think Orwell would be pleased that we continue asking some of the hard questions he raised:)
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I think there's a misconception about copyright and trademark.
Copyright protects the creator of original work from unauthorized copying.
Trademark protects a business from unfair competition. You can not set up a hamburger stand and call it McDonalds.
Neither copyright nor trademark top free speech.
Steve Jobs frequently said Microsoft Windows was a bunch of garbage. Bill Gates gritted his teeth, but he ever sued.
Suppose a book reviewer said your new book is trash and is a waste of money. You just have to suck it up. That's just an opinion.
Witness the popularity of Yelp and blogs where folks sound off on everything.
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'1984' makes me sad - as does the tragic 'Animal Farm' - George O. understood our future back then and we let it happen anyway. Politicians lie to us to get in power, then become the creatures they told us to fear, and as long as they control the media, we'll just mindlessly go along with them.
Plot development - I like the idea of a new device like the current spyware/ home-help devices that speaks to that little girl in her room. Perhaps the inventor, a mix of Jobs, Gates, Musk, et al, has managed to upload his intelligence to digital form and exists in the network he created. Children everywhere have his device in their rooms because he used his billions of dollars to ensure all children had access to this wonderful educational technology. He never had children of his own to pass on his genes, so he was obsessed with passing on his intelligence. His generosity in granting that technology to all children is the leading edge of his god-complex - he can watch all the little children all of the time, and influence them. That little girl who had a strange man talking to her in her bedroom is just one in a world-wide cult created by the digital intelligence of George O. Jogask. The book starts with her, then pans out to every child's room, everywhere, in every country and every culture, listening to their friend. 'Give me the child until he is seven, and I will show you the man.' That quote by Aristotle gives you the name of the device for all the little tots of the world - the Aris-tot.
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Lea, that is a great plot.
Write it Just like that.
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
That would be cool. Would the first author create the characters and let subsequent authors build on those so there would be some consistancy?
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
That would be cool. Would the first author create the characters and let subsequent authors build on those so there would be some consistancy?
In my mind they start with the same plot idea and maybe one or two characters that are agreed on by the group. After that the writers create their own story.
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
That would be cool. Would the first author create the characters and let subsequent authors build on those so there would be some consistancy?
In my mind they start with the same plot idea and maybe one or two characters that are agreed on by the group. After that the writers create their own story.
I like it. I don't normally write that kind of book and am not technology savvy, so it's probably not for me. But I'll buy one or two, maybe even three.
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
It's been attempted at least once since I began self-publishing. I don't think it ended well.
You might get more use out of an anthology of short stories linked to the same topic (such as home AI devices going rogue). Get eight to ten authors to write a 12k story, have each author promote the anthology to their mailing lists, use it for reader magnets, giveaways, etc. You might even have a go at the USA bestseller list (but study up on the R. Hamilton case before you do).
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I actually really like the idea of a group of authors all writing a book with the same base idea. Calling it a series and each pubbing their own book but tying the branding together with covers. It would really be cool to see how different voices transformed the same story idea.
It's been attempted at least once since I began self-publishing. I don't think it ended well.
You might get more use out of an anthology of short stories linked to the same topic (such as home AI devices going rogue). Get eight to ten authors to write a 12k story, have each author promote the anthology to their mailing lists, use it for reader magnets, giveaways, etc. You might even have a go at the USA bestseller list (but study up on the R. Hamilton case before you do).
No not like an anthology. I agree those don't end well often.
I mean each person releases their own book maintains complete control. You brand the series the same so that all the authors in the group have the same series name but you pub your own book. Include links in the back of your book to others in the series. And all the writers could/would advertise it to their newsletters as a group experiment.
Kinda like 1001 Dark Nights in romance except they do a few anthologies and I would avoid that completely. They keep branding on the covers the same but the story is their own. Those are for big name authors to share their reader bases.
Wow this is a bunch of thought for a kinda cool idea.
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... That little girl who had a strange man talking to her in her bedroom is just one in a world-wide cult created by the digital intelligence of George O. Jogask. The book starts with her, then pans out to every child's room, everywhere, in every country and every culture, listening to their friend. 'Give me the child until he is seven, and I will show you the man.' That quote by Aristotle gives you the name of the device for all the little tots of the world - the Aris-tot.
Great story setup! There are shades of that in Neal Stephenson's The Diamond Age: Or, a Young Lady's Illustrated Primer where an AI-powered electronic book that was intended for a rich man's daughter ends up in the hands of an impoverished girl.
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'1984' makes me sad - as does the tragic 'Animal Farm' - George O. understood our future back then and we let it happen anyway. Politicians lie to us to get in power, then become the creatures they told us to fear, and as long as they control the media, we'll just mindlessly go along with them.
Plot development - I like the idea of a new device like the current spyware/ home-help devices that speaks to that little girl in her room. Perhaps the inventor, a mix of Jobs, Gates, Musk, et al, has managed to upload his intelligence to digital form and exists in the network he created. Children everywhere have his device in their rooms because he used his billions of dollars to ensure all children had access to this wonderful educational technology. He never had children of his own to pass on his genes, so he was obsessed with passing on his intelligence. His generosity in granting that technology to all children is the leading edge of his god-complex - he can watch all the little children all of the time, and influence them. That little girl who had a strange man talking to her in her bedroom is just one in a world-wide cult created by the digital intelligence of George O. Jogask. The book starts with her, then pans out to every child's room, everywhere, in every country and every culture, listening to their friend. 'Give me the child until he is seven, and I will show you the man.' That quote by Aristotle gives you the name of the device for all the little tots of the world - the Aris-tot.
I want to read this. Write it please.
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No not like an anthology. I agree those don't end well often.
No. I'm saying they'd work better than each author writing an entire book.
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In my mind they start with the same plot idea and maybe one or two characters that are agreed on by the group. After that the writers create their own story.
Using shared characters creates copyright issues. Who owns the characters? Can authors use those characters in a sequel? In other works? Etc.
Easier if each author creates their own characters. Each author might have a little girl character, but each girl would be the author's own and would be free to use her in other works without having to worry about rights issues.
It becomes especially important in terms of heirs. Last thing you want is one author to pass away and then their heirs demand licensing fees from all the other authors using those "shared" characters. Those issues could possibly be avoided by having contracts to deal with those issues upfront, but I think it would just be easier to have each author create their own characters.
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In my mind they start with the same plot idea and maybe one or two characters that are agreed on by the group. After that the writers create their own story.
Using shared characters creates copyright issues. Who owns the characters? Can authors use those characters in a sequel? In other works? Etc.
Easier if each author creates their own characters. Each author might have a little girl character, but each girl would be the author's own and would be free to use her in other works without having to worry about rights issues.
It becomes especially important in terms of heirs. Last thing you want is one author to pass away and then their heirs demand licensing fees from all the other authors using those "shared" characters. Those issues could possibly be avoided by having contracts to deal with those issues upfront, but I think it would just be easier to have each author create their own characters.
Cool! Good idea!
No not like an anthology. I agree those don't end well often.
No. I'm saying they'd work better than each author writing an entire book.
Each person writes the length they are comfortable with from a short story to a novel.
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
Gee, that was years ago. Isn't it time for something about modern technology?
Why? The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
You're right, it is a stupid idea on my part.
No, it wasn't. Actually doing something like 1984 with today's culture could make for an interesting story. People thought about things differently when that book was written. Today we have all sorts of conspiracy theories and actual government watchers. (Waves at NSA.)
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So, is it time for a horror book about "them" forcing "us" to have those devices in every room so "they" can make sure we're following all of "their" rules? Probably someone has already written one.
1984 by George Orwell
Gee, that was years ago. Isn't it time for something about modern technology?
Why? The surveillance screens in 1984 are pretty much the same thing as an Alexa. Orwell was merely ahead of his time - in many facets.
You're right, it is a stupid idea on my part.
No, it wasn't. Actually doing something like 1984 with today's culture could make for an interesting story. People thought about things differently when that book was written. Today we have all sorts of conspiracy theories and actual government watchers. (Waves at NSA.)
True. Authors would be in a world of hurt if they weren't able to write a different version of an already told story. Aren't most love stories just a retelling of Cinderella?
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Several writers working on one story sharing the same characters?
It's been done before.
Back during the pulp era, several writers did this during their weekly poker game.
They took turns going to the typewriter and adding a chapter, often taking the story in different directions.
When they hit the right word count, they sold the story under a pen name and split the money.
Then they would start a new story.
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Several writers working on one story sharing the same characters?
It's been done before.
Back during the pulp era, several writers did this during their weekly poker game.
They took turns going to the typewriter and adding a chapter, often taking the story in different directions.
When they hit the right word count, they sold the story under a pen name and split the money.
Then they would start a new story.
Actually, we could do that sort of thing on a website as free content with ads for our other books. A marketing idea that might work? That way, the problem of splitting the money and possible copyright problems are eliminated.
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Several writers working on one story sharing the same characters?
It's been done before.
Back during the pulp era, several writers did this during their weekly poker game.
They took turns going to the typewriter and adding a chapter, often taking the story in different directions.
When they hit the right word count, they sold the story under a pen name and split the money.
Then they would start a new story.
Actually, we could do that sort of thing on a website as free content with ads for our other books. A marketing idea that might work? That way, the problem of splitting the money and possible copyright problems are eliminated.
Say, for example, Hollywood comes knocking and wants to make a movie of the story. With whom do they negotiate? Who owns the rights to the character and story? How will any money be split?
Or, let's say Jane, June, Joe and John all participate in the effort. Jane, June and Joe get increased book sales but John doesn't. John doesn't see any measurable increase in his book sales at all. But the others do. Jane and Joe are doing especially well. John claims his chapters are contributing to their sales so he wants a cut. The others say no. So then John wants his chapters pulled from the website. If they pull his chapters, the story falls apart. If they don't pull his chapters, he files DMCA complaint for using his copyrighted material (his chapters) without permission. Either way, you have a mess.
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Actually, that's all stuff that could be settled in a contract if those authors are so eager about it. Or they could create those characters under a Creative Commons Licence which has the nice side effect that those characters could easily be used by fans in fanfictions if wished. Or all they define in the beginning is just a character sketch with a few character traits, an occupation, a role, maybe some rough looks and then it's up to the individual author to bring this character to life, give them a name and motivation etc. Actually, unless you define a character so tight like Indiana Jones or James Bond I doubt every author comes up with exactly the same character in the end. It's like the story idea that every author would have their own twist on them.
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Marti, I like that you're always thinking outside the box. Especially with marketing ideas. :dog1:
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Marti, I like that you're always thinking outside the box. Especially with marketing ideas. :dog1:
Someday, I might actually come up with a good one. :icon_lol2:
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If a group of writers could agree on a shared starting point that was consistent through all novels, novellas, and short stories - say, the god-complex man who created Aristo-tot, it would be interesting to see the different directions each took writing about different children and families in different countries. The only consistent character would be the creator who put it out there for all the children, and perhaps an agreed-upon end ambition, such as chilling horror and the children end up killing their parents or a utopian world with hope where children care for the planet or a really unpredictable one where /George/Aristo-tot's aim is to become a god so the children destroy all religious items and, eventually, destroy all technology and revert to a tribal system where they tell and write stories of George and his messages. Only the, would George become a 'real' god to humanity. George might have his version of the Ten Commandments (maybe Twelve Lessons or Nineteen Isms or Thirty-Three Foundations) that are given to the children, but each author writing about the children in their city, town, or country would adapt these to suit their children and story. It would be interesting to see the adaptations because we know humans have always started with similar stories and made different adaptations. Ultimately, it would end in war because the different views of George would lead to fighting to defend those views.
It's fun thinking of possibilities with this. I love reading everyone's ideas.
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As for the outside chance Hollywood wanted to make the story - it could be agreed that the money goes to children of the world, in the spirit of the man who speaks to the children of the world. I don't trust most charities since the majority have 95c in the dollar going to those who run the charities, their cars, their offices, their salaries, their gala events, their friends who own advertising companies, but there must be some that are better for children than others. The idea would be based on the notion that no author benefits financially from it (though you could use it to direct readers to your other works, and to gain visibility in the world), and it is made known that anyone who wants to work on it for tv or movies follows the same altruistic lead - effort without payment. It would be unusual, novel even, and could end up getting publicity based on the 'no lawyers, just morality and the power of public opinion' - so it could grow with more authors, more stories, with fanfic, and publicity, but as soon as someone is known to profit directly from it, they are named and shamed. Legally, it seems a nightmare, but if the concept began with artists creating for arts' sake and all profits to go to children, it could cause enough negative publicity to a profiteer to deter them.
On the one hand, that seems an impossible dream - on the other hand, it could be agreed upon and just see where it goes. If someone tried to profiteer, then media love stories of corruption and 'doing the morally wrong thing'. If authors set up a website to access the stories with the rules of 'no personal profit from these stories, all money goes to XXX' (but readers are encouraged to follow the authors' links to their other works if they like their story) it would be interesting to see where it would go and at what point greed tried to thwart art for arts' sake.
Just rambling, really. Dim lights in a smoky coffee shop in late 19th Century Paris where we gather and talk rapidly in hushed tones about our ideas.
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If a group of writers could agree on a shared starting point that was consistent through all novels, novellas, and short stories - say, the god-complex man who created Aristo-tot, it would be interesting to see the different directions each took writing about different children and families in different countries. The only consistent character would be the creator who put it out there for all the children, and perhaps an agreed-upon end ambition, such as chilling horror and the children end up killing their parents or a utopian world with hope where children care for the planet or a really unpredictable one where /George/Aristo-tot's aim is to become a god so the children destroy all religious items and, eventually, destroy all technology and revert to a tribal system where they tell and write stories of George and his messages. Only the, would George become a 'real' god to humanity. George might have his version of the Ten Commandments (maybe Twelve Lessons or Nineteen Isms or Thirty-Three Foundations) that are given to the children, but each author writing about the children in their city, town, or country would adapt these to suit their children and story. It would be interesting to see the adaptations because we know humans have always started with similar stories and made different adaptations. Ultimately, it would end in war because the different views of George would lead to fighting to defend those views.
It's fun thinking of possibilities with this. I love reading everyone's ideas.
I like it, especially if it's different families in different countries. That way the outcomes could be completely different. You're right, we would just need a basic outline to go by, especially if there is a "controller" behind it that they all have to either submit to or overcome in various ways.