Author Topic: Well, this is proving a waste of time.  (Read 831 times)

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« on: November 13, 2023, 01:34:17 AM »
Haven't been promoting my books for a while so decided to do a freebie on Headmaster (after being turned down by BookBub - again). Previous bought promos haven't proved worthwhile, except for a BookBub ad which was very successful for But Can You Drink the Water?

I made Headmaster free from 9-13th November and advertised on several Facebook pages. I sent out a few WhatsApps and emails to friends and relatives who are usually supportive. I've also been tweeting (or Xing) at different time zones. I've put it on the KBoards and Goodreads and Writer Sanctum. So far I've had a grand total of 23 free downloads  :icon_rolleyes:

The best response has been from my neighbours in my retirement village asking to borrow my proof copy because they prefer to read the paperback version.  Grin

I've also received three emails (from different people) saying they can GUARANTEE me reviews. How do these people get my email address  :confused:

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

alhawke

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2023, 02:26:57 AM »
So far I've had a grand total of 23 free downloads  :icon_rolleyes:
That's an odd turnout being that you've been writing in the biz for a long time. Have you released anything new lately? Or maybe people aren't reading :evil2:. You can't say it's the economy for a free book. Sorry to hear for your scant sales.
(If you're gonna go free, you'll still get mileage with Freebooksy, though it's costly so you might not make ROI).
I've also received three emails (from different people) saying they can GUARANTEE me reviews. How do these people get my email address  :confused:
One of the promo companies ratted you out--gave your email address. Happens to me all the time.
 

Lorri Moulton

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2023, 03:58:15 AM »
There are so many variables...one being ALL the free ebooks offered right now. 

I took a quick look and maybe (I'm no expert) but the first line of the blurb might be giving off a different vibe than the rest of the blurb.  With the title and first line, this could be a lot more racy (older guy, academy full of young women) than you're intending.

With all the free ebooks, many readers only glance at the blurb.  I would lead with this:  Winner of the best Chick Lit/Women’s Lit category in the 2015 eFestival of Words

Then this:  Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered romance, where one man’s influence on a school full of wayward girls and their teachers changes their lives in ways none of them could imagine – and eventually his own.

And possibly get rid of this one:  Lust shouts. Love whispers. Only the heart knows the difference.
Again, I'm no expert.  Just my 2c.  :dog1:

ETA:  Just shared on Facebook and downloaded a copy myself!
« Last Edit: November 13, 2023, 04:07:23 AM by Lorri Moulton »

Author of Romance, Fantasy, Fairytales, Mystery & Suspense, and Historical Non-Fiction @ Lavender Cottage Books
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2023, 04:39:22 AM »
So far I've had a grand total of 23 free downloads  :icon_rolleyes:
That's an odd turnout being that you've been writing in the biz for a long time. Have you released anything new lately? Or maybe people aren't reading :evil2:. You can't say it's the economy for a free book. Sorry to hear for your scant sales.
(If you're gonna go free, you'll still get mileage with Freebooksy, though it's costly so you might not make ROI).

Yes, it's very expensive to do a paid ad as the exchange rate is something like R20 to the $1. I wouldn't mind paying for a BookBub because I know it's worth it, but paying to give something away for free sucks.  :icon_sad:

I've also received three emails (from different people) saying they can GUARANTEE me reviews. How do these people get my email address  :confused:
One of the promo companies ratted you out--gave your email address. Happens to me all the time.
I didn't use a promo company and my website doesn't give out my email address. Just had a 4th review promise email  :icon_rolleyes:

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2023, 04:49:05 AM »
There are so many variables...one being ALL the free ebooks offered right now. 

I took a quick look and maybe (I'm no expert) but the first line of the blurb might be giving off a different vibe than the rest of the blurb.  With the title and first line, this could be a lot more racy (older guy, academy full of young women) than you're intending.

With all the free ebooks, many readers only glance at the blurb.  I would lead with this:  Winner of the best Chick Lit/Women’s Lit category in the 2015 eFestival of Words

Then this:  Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered romance, where one man’s influence on a school full of wayward girls and their teachers changes their lives in ways none of them could imagine – and eventually his own.

Just posted this one to see if it works:
#FREE 9-13 Nov. Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered #Eromance Winner of the best #ChickLit/#WomensLit category in the 2015 eFestival of Words

And possibly get rid of this one:  Lust shouts. Love whispers. Only the heart knows the difference.
Again, I'm no expert.  Just my 2c.  :dog1:

ETA:  Just shared on Facebook and downloaded a copy myself!

Thanks so much  :Tup2: This is what I've been tweeting/Xing.

#FREE 9-13 Nov. Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered #Eromance. Adam changes the lives of the wayward girls and their teachers in ways none of them could imagine – and eventually his own. #ChickLit

#FREE #RomCom 9-13 Nov. Amazon websites #ebook If you enjoy a British setting then don't miss this feel-good happy-ever-after read. Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered romance.

#FREE 9-13 Nov. One man’s influence on a school full of wayward girls and their teachers changes their lives in ways none of them could imagine – and eventually his own.

Just posted this one to see if it works: PS tried to post it but Twitter/X not working at the moment  :doh:

#FREE 9-13 Nov. Intrigue, scandal and suspense simmer beneath the surface of this light-hearted and humour-peppered #Eromance Winner of the best #ChickLit/#WomensLit category in the 2015 eFestival of Words


« Last Edit: November 13, 2023, 05:48:37 AM by Jan Hurst-Nicholson »

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 
The following users thanked this post: Lorri Moulton

alhawke

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2023, 08:59:01 AM »
Another thing to consider is sales on Amazon has been really wonky this week. They're having a lot of trouble with their new interface. I had a ton of sales three days ago and like 1 over the last two days. Weird. Their old KDP reports still works, which I like, but that's because the new KDP reports is not working right. So... ? You might have to wait a week or so for a true report.
 

Vijaya

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2023, 01:38:48 AM »
Jan, sorry that the freebie isn't going as planned. I looked at it and thought, no, I don't have time right now, given my kindle is already loaded with lots of books that I still haven't read and I want to. But the library books take precedence so I don't incur fines. And there are the books I've purchased as well that wait. I'm a single data point but maybe this is useful to know? 


Author of over 100 books and magazine pieces, primarily for children
Vijaya Bodach | Personal Blog | Bodach Books
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2023, 03:57:50 AM »
Thanks so much to everyone who has chimed in or managed to download.  :tup3b Maybe more numbers will show up in the future. At least it didn't cost me anything except time. The exchange rate makes advertising very expensive.

The free downloads are now at a staggering 31  :icon_rolleyes: and I've even had 2 whole page reads (of But can You Drink The Water?).

For such paltry numbers I was surprised to see the ranking on the 12th, four days into the run (forgot to look on the previous days  :doh:)
US
•   Best Sellers Rank: #7,725 Free in Kindle Store (See Top 100 in Kindle Store)
o   #47 in General Humorous Fiction
UK
•   Best Sellers Rank: #1,132 Free in Kindle Store (See Top 100 in Kindle Store)
o   8 in General Humourous Fiction (they spell humorous incorrectly  :icon_rolleyes:)
o   27 in Humour (Kindle Store)

How many million books are now for sale on Amazon?

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Bill Hiatt

  • Trilogy unlocked
  • *****
  • Posts: 3839
  • Thanked: 1374 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Tickling the imagination one book at a time
    • Bill Hiatt's Author Website
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2023, 08:14:14 AM »
I think Timothy has estimated 75 million or so. Needless to say, most of them probably don't see much activity.

It used to be one sale would jump you from below a million to about 100,000. That may not be true anymore, or it might be worse.


Tickling the imagination one book at a time
Bill Hiatt | fiction website | Facebook author page |
 

LilyBLily

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2023, 03:00:47 PM »
Sorry the promo has seen scarce numbers. Some people swear by free and others swear at it, but usually the needle does move in a big way, even if briefly. 

 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2023, 12:19:50 AM »
I think Timothy has estimated 75 million or so. Needless to say, most of them probably don't see much activity.

It used to be one sale would jump you from below a million to about 100,000. That may not be true anymore, or it might be worse.

I can remember writers on the KBoards complaining when the number of books for sale reached 3 milllion.  :icon_rolleyes:
It seems that sales rely a lot more on marketing these days :icon_sad:

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2023, 12:24:39 AM »
Sorry the promo has seen scarce numbers. Some people swear by free and others swear at it, but usually the needle does move in a big way, even if briefly.

Final figure seems to be 34 downloads and several were by friends of friends :icon_rolleyes:. I'm still getting emails asking if I want reviews. I wonder how many writers are paying for reviews and how it works these days. I haven't bothered to reply to see what they are up to.  One mentioned Goodreads, so I'm wondering if that's were they got my email address.

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Bill Hiatt

  • Trilogy unlocked
  • *****
  • Posts: 3839
  • Thanked: 1374 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Tickling the imagination one book at a time
    • Bill Hiatt's Author Website
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2023, 12:32:35 AM »
When I first started out, people used to rave about the KDP free days as a way to build your career as a writer. I don't hear that much anymore, though some people still do get good results from a permafree first-in-series.

I suspect that the competition for free ranks is much heavier than it used to be. Though I haven't looked recently, about 20% of the titles in Smashwords were permafree the last time I looked. And I see some people on BF giving away whole books as reader magnets (though probably older ones in their catalog would be my guess).

If a reader is willing to be flexible, I think that reader could keep busy just on freebies alone.

As to sales relying a lot on marketing, that would be my take as well. The bulk of my sales each month come from AMS ads, except in new release months, when newsletter promos produce more sales (but not anywhere nearly as many as they used to). BookFunnel sales promos also seem to produce quite a few. This month, I don't have a sales promo going, and sales are the lowest they've been all year--except for the one other month when I didn't do a sales promo.

The "good" news is that if I had infinite cash to use for advertising, I could probably do pretty well.  :HB

With regard to reviews, I have the same problem with sketchy people offering something that looks suspicious like reviews for sale (even though the wording is often less direct). People who fall for those scams will probably feel Amazon's wrath eventually. I'm also buried in emails trying to sell me various kinds of promos. Interestingly, many of them are almost word for word the same, even though they nominally come from different companies. There's something wrong there, too.


Tickling the imagination one book at a time
Bill Hiatt | fiction website | Facebook author page |
 

alhawke

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2023, 04:55:53 AM »
Free works to push other books in series--in theory. I've had a modicum of success doing this, but since it hasn't been spectacular, and real meager lately, I've veered away from free. I was done this year after giving away 6k books leading to sales of only enough books to count on your fingers. They might still help with a little for KU sales for KU writers out there? (I'm wide) And I still believe in free books in exchange for building one's newsletter. Interestingly, All the BookBub promos I've had were 99c, never a free promo. Perhaps that's for the best.
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2023, 05:06:10 AM »
When I first started out, people used to rave about the KDP free days as a way to build your career as a writer. I don't hear that much anymore, though some people still do get good results from a permafree first-in-series.

If a reader is willing to be flexible, I think that reader could keep busy just on freebies alone.

As to sales relying a lot on marketing, that would be my take as well. The bulk of my sales each month come from AMS ads, except in new release months, when newsletter promos produce more sales (but not anywhere nearly as many as they used to). BookFunnel sales promos also seem to produce quite a few. This month, I don't have a sales promo going, and sales are the lowest they've been all year--except for the one other month when I didn't do a sales promo.

The "good" news is that if I had infinite cash to use for advertising, I could probably do pretty well.  :HB

With regard to reviews, I have the same problem with sketchy people offering something that looks suspicious like reviews for sale (even though the wording is often less direct). People who fall for those scams will probably feel Amazon's wrath eventually. I'm also buried in emails trying to sell me various kinds of promos. Interestingly, many of them are almost word for word the same, even though they nominally come from different companies. There's something wrong there, too.

My books are all completely different (except for Leon Chameleon) so marketing is a bit of a problem and running ads would be different for each book.

I think new writers might be susceptible to paid reviews similar to the vanity publisher scams. I think Elmore Leonard's advice still rings true. When asked what kind of writing pays the best, he answered, “Ransom notes.”  Grin

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 
The following users thanked this post: LilyBLily

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2023, 05:15:14 AM »
Free works to push other books in series--in theory. I've had a modicum of success doing this, but since it hasn't been spectacular, and real meager lately, I've veered away from free. I was done this year after giving away 6k books leading to sales of only enough books to count on your fingers. They might still help with a little for KU sales for KU writers out there? (I'm wide) And I still believe in free books in exchange for building one's newsletter. Interestingly, All the BookBub promos I've had were 99c, never a free promo. Perhaps that's for the best.

I've only managed to get one BookBub (But Can You Drink the Water?) and that was just the smaller International one. It was a free promo as BookBub say they are more likely to choose free. I'm also in KU and that also goes against their first choice. I tried to go wide in the beginning but signing into sites from SA was a nightmare. They give a drop-down menu of countries for you to tick, SA included, but when it came to the address it would only accept a US zip code.  :HB. Extremely frustrating, so I gave up.

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Bill Hiatt

  • Trilogy unlocked
  • *****
  • Posts: 3839
  • Thanked: 1374 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Tickling the imagination one book at a time
    • Bill Hiatt's Author Website
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2023, 08:34:58 AM »
Quote
They might [free first-in-series books] still help with a little for KU sales for KU writers out there?

Since KU writers get everything for free, I don't think they care about books being free to buy. Maybe there's some esoteric reason I'm missing, though.


Tickling the imagination one book at a time
Bill Hiatt | fiction website | Facebook author page |
 

LilyBLily

Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2023, 09:00:17 AM »
"I think Elmore Leonard's advice still rings true. When asked what kind of writing pays the best, he answered, 'Ransom notes.'" 

 :clap:
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #18 on: November 16, 2023, 02:29:29 AM »
This explains a lot  :icon_rolleyes:

Goodreads reports that its average click-through rate is 0.05%, which means that, if 10,000 people see an author’s ad, an average of five people will click on it.

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website
 

Bill Hiatt

  • Trilogy unlocked
  • *****
  • Posts: 3839
  • Thanked: 1374 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Tickling the imagination one book at a time
    • Bill Hiatt's Author Website
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #19 on: November 16, 2023, 07:01:35 AM »
I think I had worse luck with Goodreads ads than with any other form of advertising. Now I know why.


Tickling the imagination one book at a time
Bill Hiatt | fiction website | Facebook author page |
 

Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Epic Novel unlocked
  • ****
  • Posts: 1194
  • Thanked: 307 times
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • Just4kix Books
Re: Well, this is proving a waste of time.
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2023, 04:43:34 AM »
I think I had worse luck with Goodreads ads than with any other form of advertising. Now I know why.

Don't think I'll be wasting any money there.

Just Googled Amazon. Got a figure of 32.8 million books for sale. I think the odds for winning the lotto are better than finding a reader for your books without serious advertising.  :icon_rolleyes:

Non-fiction, Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website