Classes, classes, classes please stop

[alhawke]

Nevermind

[elleoco]

I'm sure you've heard the old saying, "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

[alhawke]

Elleoco, I was just going to just scrub the thread. But then you added an entry. So I put it back.
Just a thread complaining that the writing Biz seems "teaching"-happy spamming me with half a million instruction classes this Black Friday. More so than ever this year. Wish it would stop.

[Lynn]

I've seen it. It's overwhelming these days. I have nothing against people teaching what they can teach, but I've had to block it out. It just feels like desperation. Can't make the money writing, so let me teach you not how to make money along with me... :D

There are very few people I'd trust as a teacher. Most of them are not fellow writers.

[PJ Post]

It's social media in general.

One of the core competencies of meaningful long-term engagement is education - improving people's lives. One of the ways to earn additional revenue these days is to offer courses on whatever subject the Creative has expertise in. And because understanding is not a zero sum game, there's enough demand to support lots of them. Instead of having individual students, they package the information and sell them as classes or courses - better ROI.

Lots of them are pretty good too. But yeah, they're everywhere.

[alhawke]

Too many everywhere. It's another trend in the biz I see. And it's odd. Are writers really gulping up this stuff? Apparently they are if so many people are offering the courses. I've never once purchased a class in writing.

[Jeff Tanyard]

I'm sure you've heard the old saying, "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

"And those who can't teach, teach gym."   

Fun contrarian fact: Some of my best high school teachers were coaches.

[PJ Post]

If they're like other disciplines, I'm sure some of them are pretty good, especially for newbies. Remember, there is far less publishing information out there (blogs, forums) than there used to be, especially reliable industry information.

But they're offered because there's demand for them.

[LilyBLily]

I'm involved in soliciting teachers for classes and one-shot presentations to romance writers. There seems to be no limit to how many such classes people want, in part because there is always a flow of newbie writers and in part because the veterans will sign on because they're hunting--as we do here--for some little new idea among the well-known bits of advice. 

I thought the number of writing assistance programs being offered this Black Friday was even worse. As someone who flies by the seat of my pants and just writes in a .doc or .docx file, I'm appalled at how much "help" writers supposedly need to organize and write what after all--in romance, anyway--is usually a pretty straightforward boy-meets-girl story. Nonfiction requires organization; fiction merely requires a plot.

Yes, let it stop. 

[Bill Hiatt]

As with so many things, the trick is finding the rare gold deposit among tons of iron pyrite (fool's gold).

I have paid for a few things like that over the years. Almost invariably, I was disappointed. That said, if someone selling courses is making a fair amount of information available for free, it's easier to judge whether the paid stuff might be any good and be relevant to what you're doing.

What I've seen a lot is people padding a small amount of information to make it bulky enough to seem worth a certain price point. There might be one or two ideas buried in a sea of truisms and/or overexplanations of really basic stuff--especially annoying in a podcast or video. I find myself screaming, "Get to the ****ing point!"

[The Bass Bagwhan]

Back in my days of being trad published (mid-list obscurity) I spoke at several writers festivals, just in general talking rubbish and anecdotal tales about my favourite subject (me), and I quickly realised that most people in the audience wanted nothing else except for me to reveal THE SECRET.
THE SECRET to getting published, to getting an agent, to writing an entire book. My achievements had nothing to do with long hours, effort, and plenty of failures. I simply knew THE SECRET and I just might tell them.
I think these many, many courses present to a lot of people as a shortcut to avoiding the hard yards. A simple formula, or a template, that takes out any need for creativity, effort or talent.

[Hopscotch]

Oh, well, I know THE SECRET - You are born w/your finger on the pulse of the reading public or you ain't.  If not, then you can have fun writing but make no money.  Period.  Is that one sentence worth US$499 to a conference attendee or subscriber?  Then I'm ready to lecture.  But will an audience of shortcut seekers even hear it?

[Bill Hiatt]

THE SECRET is that there is no secret. You do the best you can with those aspects you can control, and you hope for the best.

I think a lot of people searching for THE SECRET aren't willing to put in the work and/or explore the world of publishing for themselves.

Fortunately or unfortunately, there is an element of luck in success, too--but Lady Luck doesn't kiss and tell.

Having taught at a high school for so many years, I had plenty of opportunities to see luck play out in another competitive field--college admissions. Some students did literally everything right and still didn't get into their first choice school. Other students who were good but not as good did get in. One of my students said, "It's a crap shoot." That's not entirely correct, but there is an element of luck.

[LilyBLily]

One can also liken signing up for all these courses to a standard self-help book, in which the author repeats their Big Idea endlessly throughout the book but couches it in slightly different terms each time. The hope of that author is that one of those iterations will strike a chord with the reader. The hope of the class attendee is that one word or sentence--or even one realization during the class--will finally impel them over the threshold from would-be author to real author.

I went to conferences for many years before I finished a manuscript. Maybe some people want an actual secret or shortcut, but I wanted to find or activate a shortcut in my brain to connect the desire to write to the practice of writing. There's a standard piece of advice in the business world that you should hang out with the people you admire and want to emulate. But it's not much fun when you aren't in their league, when you aren't doing the work to join their league, and yet you want to.
 

[Bill Hiatt]

It is true that repetition is a valid educational strategy. But its relevance is situational. Teachers use it with very difficult concepts or with material that is necessary but not intrinsically interesting. (Of course, you try to make it as interesting as you can, but if you are pragmatic, you also know that tune-in rates are just going to be lower.)

But authors seeking something like new sales techniques are highly motivated, so tune-in rates will be high. And people with enough background to be able to use the techniques effectively are probably sophisticated enough that they don't need as much time for the material to sink in.

[PJ Post]

A big part of the Secret is being born into the right network - having the right connections. If you have the option of being born into generational wealth, I highly recommend it. The rest is lots of exhaustive work, callused perseverance and sheer luck.

The slush pile, just by the law of averages, has passed over tons of amazing books. Both the Beatles and Elvis Presley were initially turned down by multiple record labels. I think the old adage of doing Art first and foremost because you love it is probably wise.

But hope is a massive driver. It's what fuels KDP and AMS. "Maybe I can be rich, too! If only..."

The other old chestnut is also true: the harder you work, the luckier you get.

___

I think the problem with paperback sales stems from asking the wrong question. It's not how can we sell more, it's why do people want them in the first place? Once upon a time I'd buy them in drug stores. They were everywhere as a matter of convenience. We had no other choice. But now they are an alternative reading option largely for an older demographic. Why? Is it nostalgia? They keep them? There's a reason readers select a physical thing over a virtual thing.

Figure this out and you'll be able to sell more paperbacks because you'll be able to target your messaging. And we can't go by traditional publishing because they have a completely different distribution channel that we do not have access to - like airports. Indies are not Random House.

The old self-publishing business models will continue to fail. We need to understand how the game has changed because it has. And then we need to get back to work, persevere and hope for some luck.

eta: got my threads mixed up...so reposted this in the paperback thread.

[Lorri Moulton]

Paperbacks are becoming increasingly popular with younger readers as well.  Kickstarter and other places have shown doing something unique or "fancy" can create a very niche product. 

Of course, no one has to do all the bells and whistles, but it does seem to be what's getting visibility at the moment.  TikTok (apparently) is also driving paperback sales...or so I've read in many Facebook groups.

Like "vinyl" or records show, there is something wonderful about the feel of them.  Same can be said of physical books. You can't really line up your ebooks on the shelf and enjoy them as you walk into a room.  And there are a LOT of readers who don't like ebooks. 
Find the niche that works for you. 

[Lynn]

The collectors love them. By that I mean the readers who want to own something. They still realize that digital things can be ephemeral and they want to hang on to them. I have tried to get my daughter to stop buying so many and it hasn't worked. The house is overflowing. :D

[Bill Hiatt]

I'd still be buying paper myself, except for the fact that my house is overflowing. Some years back, I enclosed a patio so that it became a room. Then I put bookcases in every wall space--deep bookcases. The original plan was to put another couple of rows of bookcases down the center, so I suppose technically that I still have space. But reshelving in a rational way--so that I can find things--takes a lot of time, so there's that.

[Lynn]

Yes, I boxed up my collection of books (most of them, anyway) 6 or 8 years ago and I haven't seen them since. I love ebooks. So convenient. (I still have them, but they're put away, I mean.)

[Jeff Tanyard]

Like "vinyl" or records show, there is something wonderful about the feel of them. 

Fun fact: I'm giving my nephew vinyl albums for Christmas.  It feels like Bizarro World to be doing that for a teenager in 2024, but here we are.   

He apparently acquired a turntable recently and is now building a record collection.  As the Cool Uncle, I'm doing my part to support him in his effort.

I can understand old people wanting vinyl albums for sentimental reasons.  But Gen Z?  That was unexpected.

The last time I purchased a vinyl album, it was in an actual record store.  It was the mid-1980s, and I was a child.  The album was Michael Jackson's "Beat it" single on a 45 RPM record.  I made the switch to cassettes not long after.

If 8-tracks suddenly become popular with the kids, I swear I'm moving to Siberia or Mars or someplace, because this timeline is just getting too weird for me.

[Hopscotch]

Vinyl sounds better than CD as a printed book reads better and more satisfyingly than an ebook.  There's also the joy of the ceremony of setting up the turntable, laying down the record and lowering the needle by hand.  Much the same as flipping printed pages to smell good paper and ink.  Can't beat either.

[Bill Hiatt]

Well, neither vinyl nor paper is as durable a medium as the electronic options, and both pose greater storage challenges. But yeah, the user experience may well be superior.

[elleoco]

Vinyl sounds better than CD as a printed book reads better and more satisfyingly than an ebook.  There's also the joy of the ceremony of setting up the turntable, laying down the record and lowering the needle by hand.  Much the same as flipping printed pages to smell good paper and ink.  Can't beat either.

Those things are very individual. Admittedly a friend used to say I had "Donald Duck ears," but if vinyl sounds better than CD, I never noticed, and I sure never found dealing with a turntable and positioning the needle satisfying, same for flipping printed pages. I won't read a book in hard copy unless it's one I really, really want to read and my library only has it in hard copy. Not being available for Kindle usually means I won't bother.

[LilyBLily]

Yes, it's individual taste. I have an automatic arm function on my high-end turntable, because putting the needle down manually is by far the best way to scratch a record badly. I figure I use the turntable about twice a year. Mostly I listen to music on bad computer speakers.

I got rid of hundreds of old paperbacks a couple of months ago and eventually I will get rid of more. I prefer reading good books as ebooks. Bad books, the kind one wants to skim, would be better as paperbacks one can eventually throw against the wall.

As for classes, since ad venues seem to change their systems constantly, there's always a need for new classes to explain what happened and what we can do about it.

[Lorri Moulton]

Goodwill and estate sales...both places to find great books and records. 

I love "vinyl" since it reminds me of my parents dancing in the summer and playing favorites at Christmas.   My dad (who passed away a few years back) had a great love of records, and we always had music playing in our house.  We moved a lot being in the military, but the books and records were always packed up and brought out again. 

Maybe when you don't have a "home" those things mean more?  It reminds me of happy times and all the different places we lived.  We finally did buy a home when my dad retired, but the records still remind me of those happy days. 

[PJ Post]

I think the 'sounds better' thing is due to the limitations of vinyl audio, which makes it sound warmer and smoother. But the latest digital reproductions are more accurate sound-wise.

Cassettes are making a comeback, too. Companies are even selling players (decks) again. They have that same limitations (dynamic range) so they have a vibe about them, which the hiss seems to contribute to.

As these recent responses hint at: form follows emotion - Hartmut Esslinger, Frog Design

[Vijaya]

We still play our albums even though I can find everything on Spotify and more. And I love my physical books too. I try to give away the books I won't read again, but sometimes it's hard to part with favorite books. We're keeping some books for our kids and future grandkids

[Bill Hiatt]

I can't part with any books unless I really don't like them. If all goes well, my heirs will be getting enough from me to make taking care of the books when I'm gone worthwhile (and some of them are readers, so they may well want to take some of the books).

I did do some research and discovered that there are several companies in my area that will come and pick whole libraries, even pack the books for you, so actually, it won't be particularly inconvenient for my heirs to deal with them.

[LilyBLily]

Keep what you love. As long as family members don't have hoarding tendencies, disposing of your personal items will not be a heavy burden--although it will be work and they may curse you now and then. Providing them with the list of disposal companies now would be a kindness. And as you know, some decisions have to be made before there is time to hunt up and read a will.

Of the many cartons of books I got rid of this year, I only regret one book, because the dialogue was interesting. I can find it again, no doubt, but the reason I disposed of it--I tore it up and recycled the paper--was that the story was toxic and the happy ending was not credible at all. I didn't want to spread that kind of poison to another reader. You might think that books are harmless, but romance books that have the heroine thinking the hero's abuse of her was her fault are not neutral; they can actively promote very bad relationship dynamics by showing them as normal and okay. Not okay.

[Bill Hiatt]

Agreed! Relationships have problems enough without normalizing the more toxic patterns.

[writeway]

They won't stop. It's a racket and always has been especially in the writing field. Many of the people doing these "classes" and "mastermind" things are not even authors. They're scammy marketers who know how to rope people in. They prey on the naive newbies who think they need all of this junk to write and sell books when you don't. Now, I'm not saying there are no legit or helpful writing classes/conferences out there. There are some well-known authors who actually run classes that are worth a shot but many of the others are just people trying get over on others who don't know how the business works. What gets me are the classes that say they are for beginners but cost hundreds of dollars. Uh, I doubt many new writers have hundreds to throw away on these classes and the people who have the money probably don't need them.

[PJ Post]

They won't stop.

The best business to be in during a goldrush is the shovel business.

[Jeff Tanyard]

They won't stop.

The best business to be in during a goldrush is the shovel business.

"A mine is a hole in the ground.  The discoverer of it is a natural liar.  The hole in the ground and the liar combine and issue shares and trap fools."  - Detroit Free Press, 1881