From what darker color to lighter color can Caucasian eyes change?

[Vidya]

I found this:

“Babies are usually born with light blue or gray eyes, yet as they grow, their eyes often get darker. This is because eye color is determined by your genes and the melanin level on your body. As you grow up, the melanin level increases around your pupil, making the eye darker. However, 10-15% of Caucasian eyes change to a lighter color as they age, as pigment in the iris changes or degrades.”

However google has not yet shown me the exact colors involved.

My scenario: there is a land in another universe, a land based on India. The people look like South East Asians. The king of this land has a son who looks Indian.

In his teen years, the son’s eyes change from dark to light and the king suspects the boy is not his son since brown people’s eyes don't change color like that. He suspects his wife had an affair with a white guy.

So from what darker color to lighter color can Caucasian eyes change?

Alternatively, what other reason could the king have to suspect his wife had an affair and this boy is not his son? What other giveaway could there be?

The other man no longer lives in this universe, so there can be no scenario where the wife meets up with her lover again.

I suppose the king could discover some old love letters, but I want him to have some strong evidence the boy is most likely not his son, evidence that becomes clear only in the boy’s teen years. Paternity tests do not exist in this universe.

Thanks for any suggestions.

[Tafkal]

I don't know the exact answer to your question, but I had blue eyes when I was a child and over the years they've changed to a kind of greeny hazel. I wouldn't say they've got either lighter or darker though.

[Maggie Ann]

Same here. Not an exact answer but my father had blue eyes and they changed to green in his forties.

My oldest daughter had blue eyes as a baby but they changed constantly from about the age of two depending on what color she wore. Gray, blue, green, gray/blue, etc. Then as she matured, they were most often hazel (greenish brown) but with any kind of emotion or illness, they would change to green.

Just as some background, I'm of Italian descent as were both my parents. As I said, my father had blue eyes, but my mother had brown eyes. I have brown eyes but my husband had blue eyes. Both daughters had blue eyes. the youngest still has blue eyes but they also change although not as drastically as my older daughter.

My grandchildren have soft gray/green eyes and blue eyes despite their father's having brown eyes.

Brown may be predominant in general, but it's not always and with DNA testing these days, it's more likely you'll find very mixed backgrounds.

If my father's family was from northern Italy, they could easily have mixed with blue-eyed Germans several generations ago and that's where my father's blue eyes came from.

[Vijaya]

My husband is a blue-eyed blond (Swedish heritage). I'm Indian. My daughter was born with gray eyes and they've turned hazel. She's so fair that strangers used to assume I was the maid or the nanny. My son is much darker, and what most people would expect coming from a mixed marriage. My maternal grandmother had gray eyes and that always fascinated me because it's so unusual.

Skin and eye color aren't on one genetic locus though. I believe there are 7 independently assorting loci so two dark people can give rise to a child with lighter skin/eye color. So yes, having a child with unusual eyes would make the king question paternity. I'd also add a unique condition that would confirm it.

[idontknowyet]

Eye color has to do with dominant and recessive traits. Babies eyes can go from blue to other colors and many times do, but they can never go from brown to blue. Blue is a recessive trait and melanin levels don't decrease without a significant illness.

If both parents have blue eyes it is impossible for them to have a brown eyed baby.

[Ampersand56]

I don’t know if this will help, but I have hazel eyes. When I was young they were mostly brown with flecks of gold and green. I desperately wanted green eyes and used to get so annoyed when people said they were brown. (Now I’m married to a brown eyed man and have a full appreciation for how beautiful brown eyes are. Teenage me was an idiot, lol)

As I’ve gotten older my eyes have shifted to green with flecks of brown and gold, and depending on the day the green can be fairly light. My youngest son has the same eye color I had at his age and everyone says they’re my husband’s brown, but we can see the hazel hiding in there. I won’t be surprised if he ends up mostly green as an adult.

[Denise]

Interesting concept.

I'd say green eyes would be a better bet in a place with people with dark eyes.

http://www.greeneyesproject.com/about-green-eyes/

https://owlcation.com/stem/The-Origins-of-Green-Eyes

You'll find lots of people with green eyes in the Middle East, Latin America, Portugal. I know cause I'm Brazilian and a lot of people there have green eyes, and it's not the red-haired type. Blue is rare, while green is quite common. Green is a variation of brown. Some people also have brown/green eyes depending on weather, etc. It's a changing eye colour.

Lots of people in Afghanistan have green eyes, so it would more realistic. Below a photo from India:


Your character could just have green eyes that don't change, eyes that are not just "baby color".

[She-la-te-da]

My mother had dark violet eyes (just like Elizabeth Taylor) that are now blue. My father had gray eyes that are now more blue. My eyes will look a different color depending on what I'm wearing (blue and they look green, and the opposite, and red they will look violet).

To be honest, I don't know that dark eyes would lighten, outside of someone having cataracts. But I'm no scientist.

[WasAnn]

There are some small populations that have a quirk in which brown eyes get lighter, kind of a light brownish that looks a bit yellow, with bleached spots. A lot of Caucasians (which includes the indian subcontinent and middle east) get lighter eyes as they get older due to melanin damage. It's not a healthy thing to have happen.

But, going from brown to blue would involve an actual change in both the structure and form of the eye that isn't possible in any regular format.

That said, certain chemicals can permanently change the color of the eye from blue to brown without harming vision.

[Vijaya]

Denise, the woman is so lovely. I must say, there's something really arresting when darker people have lighter eyes.

[Paranormal Kitty]

I'm not completely white, but I was born with blue eyes that turned greenish brown by the time I started school. My hair darkened too from light brown to very dark. A lot of the people in my family were the same way. This is fairly common because babies aren't born with all the melanin that they will have eventually. I've never heard of it going the other way though unless an illness was involved. Like one of my classmates in elementary had to go through chemo and her hair grew back in blonde when it was brown before.

[Max]

Mine went from brown as a kid to green in my thirties or so. But I don't know much on the topic. Interesting one.

[Vidya]

Thanks, everyone. My question has been answered. I’d hoped eyes could go from brown to blue but that isn't possible. I do note Max says his eyes went from brown to green but I suspect that does not happen in people with brown skin.

Possibilities:

1. it’s an alt universe. In this universe, eyes can go from brown to blue or green, at least in white people, and that is how the king knows.

2. I once read a story where a maharajah or king who lived in the time of the British Raj had several wives. He was quite old but his latest wife was young. He sent her to be tested to see why she wasnt conceiving when all his other wives had given him several children.

The doc ran tests and found the king could not have kids. Maybe because of low sperm count.

The doc was in a dilemma. If he told the king the truth, the king would realize all the kids he had with his other wives weren’t his after all.

So the doc went to the oldest wife, the senior one, and said, “Tell the youngest to conceive the same way the rest of you did.”

In no time the youngest wife was pregnant.

I read this story years ago in the Times of India. I think writers never really forget anything. Some corner of their mind will dig out some snippet they read and hand it to them when they need it.

So can I use this? How about if my story goes that the king sends his latest wife to the doc. Doc learns King is infertile.

Doc tells king. King realizes none of the kids are his. He decides to kill each one to punish the mothers. When one child escapes the first murder attempt, he tries to figure out who tried to kill him and on whose orders. When he learns the whole story, he then has to protect himself and his siblings, none of who are related to him by blood but who he naturally wants to protect from the crazed king.

For the king to be crazy enough to do this, he first has to be absolutely sure no child is his. What condition could he have that would make it clear none of the kids could be his? I read:

“Other sperm problems affect male fertility. The sperm may not be viable—that is, structurally healthy and capable of fertilization; it may be viable but unable to move correctly; it may contain the wrong number of chromosomes, the packets of genetic information; or it may have been stored too long after its formation. The vas deferens (tubes that carry sperm from the testes to the penis) may be blocked because of a past infection or injury. The man may not be able to ejaculate or his ejaculation may propel the sperm backward into his bladder rather than out through the penis. Other causes of male infertility include insufficient hormone levels, which can be supplemented with oral hormone treatments; prostate disease; untreated diabetes; or other medical conditions.”

I guess I better say the doc found his sperm is totally unviable. I’m a little reluctant because I didn't see this universe as being so medically advanced that the doc would even be able to diagnose something like this.

I googled When was totally unviable sperm first discovered and When was low sperm count first discovered. I found:

“In the 1960s, highly accurate genetic paternity testing became a possibility when HLA typing was developed, which compares the genetic fingerprints on white blood cells between the child and alleged parent. HLA tests could be done with 80% accuracy, but could not distinguish between close relatives.”

A world ruled by kings doesn't sound like it would be modern enough to know the above, but I guess it’s my universe, so I could just say the doc discovered the king is totally infertile, so the kids could not be his. One line should be enough to explain it without going into details of sperm etc.

what do you think of the above idea? is it workable?

[Vijaya]

What an interesting story about the Indian king with his many wives and not one of them being his kid.
 
A world ruled by kings could have enough technology. Remember, Indian doctors were doing cataract surgery 400 BC. I think sperm motility could be a good reason, something that could be detected through a large magnifying glass. Also a low sperm count--we still don't know why sperm need *friends* but they must secrete a molecule that helps with motility or viability.

[munboy]

Reading the quote you pasted, I assume it means the color just lightens, not that it changes colors. Like I have hazel eyes and there's a chance they could turn a lighter shade of green as I get older.

For white people, they're usually born with blue eyes and can change. I have hazel/green eyes and my wife has blue. Our daughter was born with blue eyes that turned green like mine (though, hers turned colors a little later than usual...I think she was pushing 2 when hers turned and it usually happens sooner). Our son was born with blue eyes and his stayed blue.

[idontknowyet]

Thanks, everyone. My question has been answered. I’d hoped eyes could go from brown to blue but that isn't possible. I do note Max says his eyes went from brown to green but I suspect that does not happen in people with brown skin.

Possibilities:

1. it’s an alt universe. In this universe, eyes can go from brown to blue or green, at least in white people, and that is how the king knows.

2. I once read a story where a maharajah or king who lived in the time of the British Raj had several wives. He was quite old but his latest wife was young. He sent her to be tested to see why she wasnt conceiving when all his other wives had given him several children.

The doc ran tests and found the king could not have kids. Maybe because of low sperm count.

The doc was in a dilemma. If he told the king the truth, the king would realize all the kids he had with his other wives weren’t his after all.

So the doc went to the oldest wife, the senior one, and said, “Tell the youngest to conceive the same way the rest of you did.”

In no time the youngest wife was pregnant.

I read this story years ago in the Times of India. I think writers never really forget anything. Some corner of their mind will dig out some snippet they read and hand it to them when they need it.

So can I use this? How about if my story goes that the king sends his latest wife to the doc. Doc learns King is infertile.

Doc tells king. King realizes none of the kids are his. He decides to kill each one to punish the mothers. When one child escapes the first murder attempt, he tries to figure out who tried to kill him and on whose orders. When he learns the whole story, he then has to protect himself and his siblings, none of who are related to him by blood but who he naturally wants to protect from the crazed king.

For the king to be crazy enough to do this, he first has to be absolutely sure no child is his. What condition could he have that would make it clear none of the kids could be his? I read:

“Other sperm problems affect male fertility. The sperm may not be viable—that is, structurally healthy and capable of fertilization; it may be viable but unable to move correctly; it may contain the wrong number of chromosomes, the packets of genetic information; or it may have been stored too long after its formation. The vas deferens (tubes that carry sperm from the testes to the penis) may be blocked because of a past infection or injury. The man may not be able to ejaculate or his ejaculation may propel the sperm backward into his bladder rather than out through the penis. Other causes of male infertility include insufficient hormone levels, which can be supplemented with oral hormone treatments; prostate disease; untreated diabetes; or other medical conditions.”

I guess I better say the doc found his sperm is totally unviable. I’m a little reluctant because I didn't see this universe as being so medically advanced that the doc would even be able to diagnose something like this.

I googled When was totally unviable sperm first discovered and When was low sperm count first discovered. I found:

“In the 1960s, highly accurate genetic paternity testing became a possibility when HLA typing was developed, which compares the genetic fingerprints on white blood cells between the child and alleged parent. HLA tests could be done with 80% accuracy, but could not distinguish between close relatives.”

A world ruled by kings doesn't sound like it would be modern enough to know the above, but I guess it’s my universe, so I could just say the doc discovered the king is totally infertile, so the kids could not be his. One line should be enough to explain it without going into details of sperm etc.

what do you think of the above idea? is it workable?

There are several common illnesses that can cause infertility once such is adult onset chicken pox.

[Ghost]

I just happened into a scientific paper that may interest you. Quote provided below: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/article-abstract/642125

Conclusion:  Most individuals achieve stable eye color by 6 years of age. However, a subpopulation of 10% to 15% of white subjects have changes in eye color through-out adolescence and adulthood in the eye color range that can be expected to reflect changes in iridial melanin content or distribution. These data also suggest that such changes in eye color, or the propensity to such changes, may be genetically determined.

[notthatamanda]

Alternatively, what other reason could the king have to suspect his wife had an affair and this boy is not his son? What other giveaway could there be?
Thanks for any suggestions.

Did the king know his son's biological father?  If so I'd say voice plus mannerisms.  The son's voice is going to change and something in a look or the way he tilts his head when he says something and all of the sudden the king realizes who his son reminds him of.