Author Topic: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here  (Read 491 times)

Leo

Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« on: November 01, 2018, 05:49:33 AM »
Thought everyone might like to read what Joanna has to say about her visit to the states and the NINC conference. She always has something of interest that I can take-away and apply in my own work.

https://www.thecreativepenn.com/2018/10/08/doubling-down-on-what-you-love-and-opportunities-when-publishing-wide-my-ninc-2018-round-up/?utm_source=Findaway+Voices&utm_campaign=32cbe902fb-NEWS_ROUNDUP_2018_10&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_b9f710d3f4-32cbe902fb-99103937
Post-apocalypse or epic fantasy anyone?
Or perhaps tarot and astrology are more up your alley?

 
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CoraBuhlert

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2018, 11:31:01 AM »
 :goodpost:
Thanks for the link, Leo. A lot of helpful advice there. I particularly like the thing about the Id list.

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Genres: All of them, but mostly science fiction and mystery/crime
 

Leo

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2018, 12:22:47 PM »
:goodpost:
Thanks for the link, Leo. A lot of helpful advice there. I particularly like the thing about the Id list.

Hi Cora, I hate to admit to ignorance, but I saw that she mentioned the 'Id' list a few times. Despite trying to find more info on it I still have no idea what it is.  :shrug

Would you kindly explain it to me, please?
Post-apocalypse or epic fantasy anyone?
Or perhaps tarot and astrology are more up your alley?

 

CoraBuhlert

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2018, 12:55:37 PM »
The way I understood it, it's making a list of all the things that are like narrative catnip to you and make you read even a not very good book/watch a not very good movie, because it has trope X and you just love trope X. In short, those tropes appeal to your subconscious or Id. Some of mine are galactic rebellions, prisons and prison breaks, execution scenes with last minute rescues, found families, people bonding over food, seaside settings, pirates, etc...

Quite often, these tropes also show up in our own writing. And sometimes, we're tempted to edit them out, because this is the seventh time we've written about X and we fear we're boring our readers with X.  But there are other people out there who like the same things we do, though probably not the exact same combination. We only need to find them. If you make a list of stuff you really like in fiction and/or stuff that keeps showing up in your own fiction. It's helpful for identifying the elements that make your writing unique and also for figuring out how to market your books to people who like the same things. For example, Joanna Penn said that she put some of the elements from her Id list in her marketing copy.

Coincidentally, it also helps figuring out which tropes you absolutely can't stand and which will ruin even an otherwise good work for you. 

 

Blog | Pegasus Pulp | Newsletter | Author Central | Twitter | Instagram
Genres: All of them, but mostly science fiction and mystery/crime
 
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Leo

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2018, 03:23:46 PM »
thanks Cora, now that makes sense. I like to include scenes like cooking and eating, friendship and unity, it often all comes together at a meal.
Post-apocalypse or epic fantasy anyone?
Or perhaps tarot and astrology are more up your alley?

 

Crystal

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2018, 04:08:04 AM »
I love the idea of publishing id. It makes a lot of sense. I've heard a lot of people say that billionaires have an innate appeal, because of the money and power, and the desire for security so many people have. The wealth always seemed like the main draw of the genre, much more so than the BDSM or the tortured heroes or any other common themes.

I also love the idea of embracing what you love. There are two tropes I love to death--friends to lovers and pretend girlfriend. I realized I write most of my books as friends to lovers books, even if they're wrapped in a different trope (coworkers, brother's best friend, etc.). And my favorite book of mine is the one that was about friends pretending they were in love. Of course it was my favorite. It was my two favorite tropes!

Like most authors, I've gotten reviews complaining about too many similarities in my books. I think I need to start ignoring those (and the "too much sex" reviews. Though, TBH, I don't pay much attention to negative reviews. I'm more concerned with pleasing current readers. If people don't like my writing style, they aren't going to like my writing style. Which is fine. There are lots of other books they can read).

I've made a conscious effort not to repeat tropes within a series, for the sake of variety for both myself and readers. But as I'm writing longer series (this one is EIGHT BOOKS!!!), I'm having to reach for tropes that aren't as appealing to me. I like the idea of stretching myself, but I think maybe I stretch myself too often. I love the feel of a challenge, but sometimes I need to write something that comes easily. I've been recentering my WIP on the friends in lovers trope, thinking of everything I love about it and writing that, and it's going much better.

I'd love to attend NINC one year. Next year, I'm attending RARE in September, but I'm going to try to attend in 2020.
 
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CoraBuhlert

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2018, 12:31:57 PM »
The Cinderella fantasy is extremely popular among romance readers whether it's billionaires in contemporary romance or dukes in regency romances.  It's not a fantasy that particularly appeals to me, probably because I've been raised to take care of myself and not expect a man to do it, though there are books with extremely wealthy heroes I like a whole lot. 

Though in my own work (not a pure romance writer, but I have some stories with strong romantic elements), I tend to write heroines who are wealthier and/or of a higher class than the hero. And if the hero is wealthier or of a higher class, there's something else that's wrong with him. He's rich, but a pirate or a disgraced aristocrat or that sort of thing. In fact, "woman falls in love with a man from the wrong side of the tracks" is probably something I should put on my id list. 

Blog | Pegasus Pulp | Newsletter | Author Central | Twitter | Instagram
Genres: All of them, but mostly science fiction and mystery/crime
 

Crystal

Re: Joanna Penn on NINC 2018 - heaps of useful information here
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2018, 06:21:21 AM »
The Cinderella fantasy is extremely popular among romance readers whether it's billionaires in contemporary romance or dukes in regency romances.  It's not a fantasy that particularly appeals to me, probably because I've been raised to take care of myself and not expect a man to do it, though there are books with extremely wealthy heroes I like a whole lot. 

Though in my own work (not a pure romance writer, but I have some stories with strong romantic elements), I tend to write heroines who are wealthier and/or of a higher class than the hero. And if the hero is wealthier or of a higher class, there's something else that's wrong with him. He's rich, but a pirate or a disgraced aristocrat or that sort of thing. In fact, "woman falls in love with a man from the wrong side of the tracks" is probably something I should put on my id list.

I think hero from the wrong side of the tracks falls into a loose "bad boy" umbrella. The everlasting appeal of the bad boy has a lot to do with the drive for rebellion in all of us. As we get older and settle down more, tales of rebellion can be even more escapist.

Movies goers like Han Solo for the same reasons that romance readers like bad boys. This stuff isn't genre specific (though it presents differently in different genres).