Int'l Only Bookbub Promos worth it?

[JRTomlin]

I have just been offered a 99¢ one in Australia, India, Canada, and the UK. I do get good sales in the UK on that series. It's the second in the series. I don't think I've ever done an international only promo.

Thoughts? How have the international ones worked out for people who have had them?

I am actually considering turning it down and trying for one in all regions with another novel. (Yes, I know turning down a BB is shocking)

[TimothyEllis]

I've had one.

Everyone gushed about how good it went, but I was extremely disappointed in the results.

My primary market is the US, and a promo aimed everywhere else was about as pointless as I thought it would be. But it had to be tried. Subsequently trying to get the US version was rejected, which reinforced in my mind the results were not up to even BB's expectations as a test. But given my country breakdown, nothing else should have been expected.

As an Australian author, I sometimes wonder if BB book choosers think my primary market is Aus and UK. And therefore promoing into the US is a waste of their list. While UK is important to me, the US is where I sell most.

By comparison, Freebooksy at half the price, was twice as good.

I'll never do an International BB again. Just not worth it imo.

[JRTomlin]

Thanks. I really have my doubts about how worthwhile it is for the cost.

I am generally (although not always) lucky about getting BB promotions and one thing that occurs to me that is probably silly but I wonder if I might annoy them if I turn this one down.

[ashleycapes]

My international-only promos have always yielded really solid results - but I imagine my genre(s) plays a part in that?

[notthatamanda]

Building off what Tim had said, I always did better with Freebooksy than Bargainbooksy (99cents) which was terrible.  By comparison my 99 cent Intl bookbub was fantastic, I got best seller badges in UK CA and IN.  The UK readers gave me absolutely lovely reviews.  The money I made I funneled into AMS/AA ads and that gave me my start there.  My only disappointment, I couldn't do AMS/AA ads in the UK and keep the ranks up, to keep the visibility up, to keep the sales up.  But that was an AMS problem not a bookbub one.  This was for my psych thriller.

But I never did the second in a series promo. (Two romance trilogies)  I always just promoted the first book.   And the bookbub was for a standalone.

If you're not sure, maybe tell them you don't think you can recoup the costs with an Intl only, maybe they'll come back with a counter offer, if they want to fill the slot.  I would worry about they getting annoyed too, but I worry about everything, so don't worry about that based on my perception.

[angela]

I had one in mystery back in February, and based on that, I won't take an international-only ad again.

[123mlh]

I've had about six international only BBs across four categories for three different titles. Made my money back within four days for all of them, some same day. That's using sellthrough, not just on the advertised title. So I take them when offered. But I do know of an author who turned one down and they came back and offered him the full one. I think that's rare though.

[JRTomlin]

One thing I wanted to confirm was that this would not have any effect on my ability to get a US promo. I thought it wouldn't but decided to ask and this was the answer:

Hi JR,

That isn't a bad question! Our editors consider submissions for different regions separately and our timing rules apply to each region separately, so accepting this promotion wouldn't affect your submissions for a US promotion.

 

[notthatamanda]

One thing I wanted to confirm was that this would not have any effect on my ability to get a US promo. I thought it wouldn't but decided to ask and this was the answer:

Hi JR,

That isn't a bad question! Our editors consider submissions for different regions separately and our timing rules apply to each region separately, so accepting this promotion wouldn't affect your submissions for a US promotion.

 

This is interesting, thanks for posting.  For years I have been seeing people post about getting Bookbub, or Int'l only, now Ethan has a US only.  I had assumed a "bookbub" was for all territories.   However, I think they are referring to the fact that when you do the Int'l bookbub, they will grey out your entries on the other countries for six months, not whether they will be annoyed if you turn them down.

[Jan Hurst-Nicholson]

My only BookBub was an International in April. As the book is primarily aimed at British expats the International was more suitable. I did a 'free' one and they predicted 3500 downloads - I got over 7000. I had some good sales and page reads, mostly in the UK, but a good proportion in Canada, Australia and India. In fact I had at least one on every Amazon site. I've got a number of new reviews, and my Goodreads ratings have increased from 144 to 267 with a number still 'reading' or 'to read'. I'm still getting more sales and page reads than I had before the BookBub, so for this particular book it was well worth it, but I'm not sure my other books would be as successful.

[TimothyEllis]

and my Goodreads ratings have increased from 144 to 267 with a number still 'reading' or 'to read'.

As far as I can tell, 'reading' on Goodreads is the number of people who abandoned your book without finishing it.

'To read' means they added it, but never got around to reading it, and probably never will.

[Jan Hurst-Nicholson]

and my Goodreads ratings have increased from 144 to 267 with a number still 'reading' or 'to read'.

As far as I can tell, 'reading' on Goodreads is the number of people who abandoned your book without finishing it.

'To read' means they added it, but never got around to reading it, and probably never will.

There is a 'to read' and a 'currently-reading'. They change almost daily and as the number of the 'currently-reading' goes down it often corresponds with a rating. I know that some readers do mark books 'to read' , especially if you did a print 'giveaway' on Goodreads, and never get round to reading them, but the currently-reading is more reliable.

[TimothyEllis]

There is a 'to read' and a 'currently-reading'. They change almost daily and as the number of the 'currently-reading' goes down it often corresponds with a rating. I know that some readers do mark books 'to read' , especially if you did a print 'giveaway' on Goodreads, and never get round to reading them, but the currently-reading is more reliable.

As far as I can tell, mine have never gone down. They just keep growing. Never done any sort of giveaway on Goodreads. The only promo I tried with them was a complete waste of time, and they ended up giving me half my money back because they couldn't spend it.

[Jan Hurst-Nicholson]

There is a 'to read' and a 'currently-reading'. They change almost daily and as the number of the 'currently-reading' goes down it often corresponds with a rating. I know that some readers do mark books 'to read' , especially if you did a print 'giveaway' on Goodreads, and never get round to reading them, but the currently-reading is more reliable.

As far as I can tell, mine have never gone down. They just keep growing. Never done any sort of giveaway on Goodreads. The only promo I tried with them was a complete waste of time, and they ended up giving me half my money back because they couldn't spend it.

Yes, some of them are stuck. If you click on the 'currently-reading' you can see who the readers are and some are 'currently-reading' 100s of books, so you can discount them.
I haven't done a promo. I've only given away print books, which cost me the price of the book and postage. If you enter one of these giveaways Goodreads asks if you want to put the book on your 'to-read' list, and most people do, but they rarely go on to buy the book if they don't win a copy, and the 'to-read' stays there forever.

[JRTomlin]

Just got a "You have to make up your mind now" email from BB and still haven't made up my mind. 

[notthatamanda]

Do you think your diminishing returns for that series are because you've exhausted the readers they have for your specific historical fiction genre?  I wanted to ask that anyway, and it seemed like a good time.

[JRTomlin]

Do you think your diminishing returns for that series are because you've exhausted the readers they have for your specific historical fiction genre?  I wanted to ask that anyway, and it seemed like a good time.

I didn't say that I have diminishing returns for the series. (Maybe I was talking about another series) Or if I inadvertently indicated that it was a misstatement. As a matter of fact, I don't have diminishing sales for the series; they're pretty amazingly steady. It still sells better than more recent series because of the characters and setting. You can always sell books about King Robert the Bruce, or about his amazing follower the Black Douglas. 

What I said was that I am not sure I'd have a good enough RoI to justify having an Int'l only promotion since by far my largest market is the US. I have what I consider decent sales for it in the UK, particularly in Scotland, but I am not sure that would translate into a good enough RoI. It would also mean no combined US & int'l promotion for a while.

If you look at the total sales for the major figure in my genre, Bernard Cornwell, who as of a couple of years ago had sold some 30+ million novels, I suspect I still have room for sales. Now a different question might be whether I have exhausted the readers for the genre who are BB members.  I have considered that, but considering the size of their historical fiction list which was about 3 million a year or so ago, I don't think so. Historical fiction is their third-largest list and also I have three HF series that I alternate. Of course, when something like Netflix's Outlaw King comes out that always helps. The sales pattern for historical fiction is totally different from romance for example and novels can continue to have steady sales for many years.

ETA: And I am working on the first novel in a new series right now. 

I think that I will accept it basically as an experiment so see how it does. The cost isn't that high. Unfortunately, I'll be hard-pressed to support it with secondary ads another disadvantage.

[notthatamanda]

Oh sorry I didn't mean to offend you.  I meant, like you said, if you thought you had exhausted the BB membership for the genre.

I wonder if there are any breakdowns of numbers, for readers, for the different subsets of historical fiction?   Amazon lists them mostly by country, but then within each country there are the different eras.  Obviously some people read more than one subset of the genre, but some people only have interest in a select few.

Good luck with your promotion.

[JRTomlin]

I wasn't offended at all. No worries. It is a logical question. I was just trying to figure out how to answer it. And if I had indeed said that lol

Truthfully I think the most important subsets are by period. Some people mainly or only read medieval or Tudor era (which isn't medieval although it gets stuck there) or American Revolution or WWII, etc. I think if people like a certain period they may care less which country it is set in even if they have a favorite country.

I've never seen a breakdown by period or country. In the US there are more people with Scottish ancestry than there are people living in Scotland by a large margin so novels with a Scottish setting appeal to those as well as medieval fiction fans. It isn't a straightforward genre to figure out, that's for sure.

[notthatamanda]

Okay, I'm glad I didn't offend you.  Best of luck with the BB.