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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The future of writing?
« Last post by Jeff Tanyard on January 28, 2026, 08:54:12 AM »
"When in doubt, blame the schools."


Who's in doubt?  I'm certainly not.   :icon_rofl:

Don't make the mistake, Bill, of thinking you're the only former school system employee here.  You're not.  I've never been a teacher, but I've worked in the bureaucracy.  I've seen how the sausage is made, and I made some of it myself.  I'm familiar with the educational-industrial complex, a creature most people don't know exists but is just as slimy as the more widely-known military-industrial complex.  And no, I'm not talking about textbook publishers.

I've also seen teachers with decades of experience look like wide-eyed children when they visit the central office and really see the behind-the-scenes stuff for the first time.  Most teachers simply have no idea how the system actually works outside of the actual school buildings.

The system exists for those who are profiting from it, and I don't mean the teachers.  Any actual learning that occurs among the students is a nice bonus but still incidental.


My grammar school experience was back in the Dark Ages, but my mother used to say how lucky I was in my first grade class. There were only two in my school, but one teacher - mine - started our reading experience using Phonics and the other used whole word recognition. At the time I didn't understand why Mom said that, now I do, and effects of one over the other seem to still haunt schools today.


Your mother sounds like she was wise beyond her years.

The whole point of a written language is to codify the spoken language.  We all learn to talk before we learn to read, and even illiterate tribes have spoken languages.  Phonics, by turning spoken sounds into symbols, enables the easiest possible transition from the spoken word to the written word.  A hieroglyphic system, which is what "whole word" essentially boils down to, makes that transition needlessly more difficult.  In fact, it's not really a transition at all; it's more like a completely separate venture.  Kids can learn to read that way, but it's harder, and more kids will fall by the wayside.


I learned to read in the Stone Age of Dick and Jane.  My Millennial daughter learned from Dr. Seuss.  Both worked.  Perhaps not for every kid in the classroom.  But the key for both of us was parents who read to us at bedtime, pointing out the word-sources for their reading, firing the child's curiosity. 


Parents reading to their kids is absolutely crucial.  I was also fortunate in that regard.   :cheers

I learned the alphabet from Sesame Street.  I was probably two or three years old.  When Mom heard me singing the alphabet song along with the characters on the show, she decided it was time to start teaching me how to read.  I particularly enjoyed the Berenstain Bears and the "read-along" books with 45-rpm records that I would play on my Fisher-Price record player.   :icon_mrgreen:
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The future of writing?
« Last post by elleoco on January 28, 2026, 05:28:42 AM »
My experience with modern education is strictly in observing a lot of the results in places like forums dedicated to other interests, and I've got to tell you a lot of modern people are close to illiterate. They make posts so bad it's almost impossible to figure out what they mean. Then I also remember a sheriff's deputy of my county bemoaning the fact that most of the young people they have to deal with can't sign their names. To a lesser extent it's also in online articles authored by people you'd expect to be wordsmiths.

Younger people are also ignorant of history to an alarming degree.

My grammar school experience was back in the Dark Ages, but my mother used to say how lucky I was in my first grade class. There were only two in my school, but one teacher - mine - started our reading experience using Phonics and the other used whole word recognition. At the time I didn't understand why Mom said that, now I do, and effects of one over the other seem to still haunt schools today.

Since I bought a new car this past September, I joined some car forums, and there you see the startling inability of people to do basic math concerning things like car loans and negative equity. A lot aren't too bright about reading things before signing them either. Is that because reading a multi-page contract is too difficult? Ages aren't so apparent there, but still ...
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The furture of writing?
« Last post by Anarchist on January 28, 2026, 04:32:49 AM »
Also, she looks like Agent Scully, so I couldn't really not give her a chance.  ;)





There will always be only one Scully.





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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The future of writing?
« Last post by Bill Hiatt on January 28, 2026, 03:31:23 AM »
"When in doubt, blame the schools."

In the interest of full disclosure, I haven't watched the whole video yet. (Edit: I listened to the rest as I typed his response.)

The presenter assumes a remarkable degree of homogeneity in American education. I taught for 36 years, the last one being I think school year 2014-2015. Among other things, I was a department chair, the coordinator of the honors program, BHEA (union) director-at-large for the high school, and a member of the superintendent's advisory council or similar under three different superintendents. In other words, I have a lot of experience, not only in English teaching but in the larger school in general.

When was the first time I heard about critical literacy? Today. Yes, the philosophy that the presenter claims was dominant since the 1990s and seemingly more or less universal, I had literally never heard of.

Are there controversies in education over the best way to teach reading (and many other things)? Yes. But phonics has always had its defenders, and though I wasn't involved in teaching reading in elementary schools directly, I certainly taught thousands of people who were the product of the supposedly homogeneous educational system the presenter denounces. They were almost all functioning above the level that the presenter assumes is pretty much all our schools produce. They almost all read whole books, wrote coherent essays, and though some used Spark Notes, they could also perform on spontaneous reading tasks and/or read books for which such aids were not available.

The high school I worked in was a good one, but it was by no means the best. Yet according to the presenter, such schools literally do not exist.

The truth is that the federal government, even if it wanted to, has few mechanisms for enforcing a particular teaching method. The states have a wider range of options but are much more diverse in their attitudes. Local school boards are the same way. And ultimately, teachers have much greater influence over the way in which things are actually taught than the video suggests.  As one of my colleagues once said about what to do if an administrator is pushing you to move in a way you know isn't optimal, "Smile sweetly, close your classroom door, and do whatever you damn please." Now, this isn't always a good situation, but it does make possible a teacher being able to teach effectively even if there were hypothetically some constraints on best practices.

In addition, good modern schools are also heavily reliant on data-driven decision-making, which means that the teachers involved in the teaching of reading would have more exposure to the related research than the presenter assumes. Also, the efforts to construct standardized tests that measure critical thinking (in the correct definition of the term) are having positive effects. Teacher practices will sometimes be informed by high stakes tests, which can sometimes be a bad thing, but which in this instance should force a move toward more effective teaching of reading where such teaching doesn't already exist. For better or worse, everybody does the public accountability dance.

As far as writing is concerned, I run across excellent examples of it every single day, many by people young to have supposedly been stunted by critical literacy.

Are there bad schools? Sure. But is the pattern universal and government promoted? Not as far as I can tell. The relatively decentralized nature of the system would mitigate against such an outcome.

Also, there are other explanations for the gaps that the presenter notes:
erratic funding for schools
the tendency to fund through local property taxes, which means that students from poor families are more likely to attend poor schools
the rise of entertainment alternatives to reading, like TV and video games, as well as an internet structure geared to short attention spans
and many other things...

There are many ways in schools could certainly improve. But my experience suggests that the dystopian view espoused by the presenter is, at best, an overgeneralization. 
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The future of writing?
« Last post by Hopscotch on January 28, 2026, 01:21:47 AM »
I learned to read in the Stone Age of Dick and Jane.  My Millennial daughter learned from Dr. Seuss.  Both worked.  Perhaps not for every kid in the classroom.  But the key for both of us was parents who read to us at bedtime, pointing out the word-sources for their reading, firing the child's curiosity.  Lincoln had barely a year of formal schooling on the frontier but an illiterate mother who pushed him to learn reading.  He did okay.  We need some new teaching scheme less than we need parents to just read to their kids at bedtime.
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The future of writing?
« Last post by Cabbages and kings on January 27, 2026, 11:16:34 PM »
She does look similar to agent Scully from "The X-Files".  Grin
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / Re: The furture of writing?
« Last post by Jeff Tanyard on January 27, 2026, 04:16:17 PM »
I've watched a few of her videos.  One of them popped up in my YouTube recommendation sidebar one day, and I decided to give it a try.  Also, she looks like Agent Scully, so I couldn't really not give her a chance.  ;)

As a long-time critic of the public school system, I completely agree with her about the "whole word" stuff that the schools taught for a time (and that some might still each).  I can't imagine how many kids have had their brains stunted by that garbage.

And, of course, I agree with her about AI usage causing people's brains to atrophy.  AI is like fire: a useful servant, but a fearful master.
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Quill and Feather Pub [Public] / The future of writing?
« Last post by Cabbages and kings on January 27, 2026, 03:43:20 AM »

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So how long should it take to edit every 100 pages?
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IngramSpark / Re: Ingram Spark will offer free updates beginning in January 2026
« Last post by Twolane on January 26, 2026, 11:50:58 PM »
Quote
A 1.875% market access fee applies for books enabled for distribution.

I'll gladly suffer 1.875 per cent over 50 bucks a pop. And face it, 25 bucks for a single update was pretty much dead in the water. We all know that it was a new cover plus the interior for 50 bucks. If one wanted an acceptable standard of print book, that is.
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